From lucindap at comcast.net Sat Feb 2 18:26:02 2008 From: lucindap at comcast.net (Lucinda Pitcairn) Date: Sat, 02 Feb 2008 16:26:02 -0800 Subject: [Access] Minutes of last AC meeting for posting on the website Message-ID: <47A50A1A.2050602@comcast.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.uueugene.org/pipermail/access/attachments/20080202/96dbc2c6/attachment.html From lucindap at comcast.net Mon Feb 4 16:25:00 2008 From: lucindap at comcast.net (Lucinda Pitcairn) Date: Mon, 04 Feb 2008 14:25:00 -0800 Subject: [Access] Tentative Agenda for Tuesday Evening Meeting for Posting on Website Message-ID: <47A790BC.8080608@comcast.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.uueugene.org/pipermail/access/attachments/20080204/8fbd7e15/attachment.html From leslie_gilbert at msn.com Mon Feb 4 17:08:21 2008 From: leslie_gilbert at msn.com (leslie gilbert) Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2008 15:08:21 -0800 Subject: [Access] Tentative Agenda for Tuesday Evening Meeting for Posting on Website In-Reply-To: <47A790BC.8080608@comcast.net> References: <47A790BC.8080608@comcast.net> Message-ID: I won't be there to talk about the game, and Jean-Marie and I haven't gotten together yet to plan it. Phylis says that yes we can do it at the April potluck. Jean-Marie- can you call me so we can talk about it and/or make plans to get together? Thanks! Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2008 14:25:00 -0800From: lucindap at comcast.netTo: webmaster at uueugene.orgCC: access at uueugene.orgSubject: [Access] Tentative Agenda for Tuesday Evening Meeting for Posting on Website UUCE ACCESSIBILITY COMMITTEETentative Agenda February 5, 2008, 7:00 pm Candle-lighting and Reading - Jeanne-Marie Moore (5 minutes) Brief Check-ins (5 minutes)Agenda and Time/Item Adjustments - David Gilmartin (3 minutes)Secretary's Report - Cindy Pitcairn (5 minutes)OLD BUSINESS Accessibility Survey - David Gilmartin (20 minutes) Reports from Liaisons to Other Committees (10 minutes) * * * Break (5 minutes) * * * Committee's Web pages - David Gilmartin (15 minutes)Meeting Dates for 2008 (5 minutes)Game Night Plans - Leslie Gilbert, Jean-Marie Moore (15 minutes)NEW BUSINESS (TBD)Check-outs (5 minutes)Closing circleAdjournment _________________________________________________________________ Need to know the score, the latest news, or you need your Hotmail?-get your "fix". http://www.msnmobilefix.com/Default.aspx -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.uueugene.org/pipermail/access/attachments/20080204/ff09c0cb/attachment.html From algaelady at gmail.com Mon Feb 4 19:02:15 2008 From: algaelady at gmail.com (jeannemarie moore) Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2008 17:02:15 -0800 Subject: [Access] Tentative Agenda for Tuesday Evening Meeting for Posting on Website In-Reply-To: References: <47A790BC.8080608@comcast.net> Message-ID: <00aa01c86792$c040fdb0$6401a8c0@TheMachine> Leslie, I forgot your phone number. Sorry you'll miss the meeting. j-m. _____ From: access-bounces at uueugene.org [mailto:access-bounces at uueugene.org] On Behalf Of leslie gilbert Sent: Monday, February 04, 2008 3:08 PM To: Accessibility group; Martha Osgood Subject: Re: [Access] Tentative Agenda for Tuesday Evening Meeting for Posting on Website I won't be there to talk about the game, and Jean-Marie and I haven't gotten together yet to plan it. Phylis says that yes we can do it at the April potluck. Jean-Marie- can you call me so we can talk about it and/or make plans to get together? Thanks! _____ Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2008 14:25:00 -0800 From: lucindap at comcast.net To: webmaster at uueugene.org CC: access at uueugene.org Subject: [Access] Tentative Agenda for Tuesday Evening Meeting for Posting on Website UUCE ACCESSIBILITY COMMITTEE Tentative Agenda February 5, 2008, 7:00 pm Candle-lighting and Reading - Jeanne-Marie Moore (5 minutes) Brief Check-ins (5 minutes) Agenda and Time/Item Adjustments - David Gilmartin (3 minutes) Secretary's Report - Cindy Pitcairn (5 minutes) OLD BUSINESS Accessibility Survey - David Gilmartin (20 minutes) Reports from Liaisons to Other Committees (10 minutes) * * * Break (5 minutes) * * * Committee's Web pages - David Gilmartin (15 minutes) Meeting Dates for 2008 (5 minutes) Game Night Plans - Leslie Gilbert, Jean-Marie Moore (15 minutes) NEW BUSINESS (TBD) Check-outs (5 minutes) Closing circle Adjournment _____ Need to know the score, the latest news, or you need your HotmailR-get your "fix". Check it out. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.uueugene.org/pipermail/access/attachments/20080204/a3a705b0/attachment.html From mariah at efn.org Wed Feb 6 02:03:30 2008 From: mariah at efn.org (d. maria) Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2008 00:03:30 -0800 Subject: [Access] meeting tonight Message-ID: I'm sorry I missed our meeting and didn't have a chance to let anyone know I wouldn't be there. My cat was actively dying and could not transition... He was struggling to take his last breath... continuing in coma to breath on... I couldn't leave him alone to transition alone. He finally passed about 9pm. Hope all went well at the meeting and I'm sorry to have missed it. blessings all, dm From leslie_gilbert at msn.com Wed Feb 6 12:35:33 2008 From: leslie_gilbert at msn.com (leslie gilbert) Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2008 10:35:33 -0800 Subject: [Access] meeting tonight In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I am sorry for your loss. Looking forward to seeing you soon. Leslie> To: access at uueugene.org> From: mariah at efn.org> Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2008 00:03:30 -0800> Subject: [Access] meeting tonight> > I'm sorry I missed our meeting and didn't have a chance to let anyone > know I wouldn't be there. My cat was actively dying and could not > transition... He was struggling to take his last breath... continuing > in coma to breath on... I couldn't leave him alone to transition alone. > He finally passed about 9pm. Hope all went well at the meeting and > I'm sorry to have missed it.> blessings all, dm> > _______________________________________________> Access mailing list> Access at uueugene.org> http://www.uueugene.org> http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access _________________________________________________________________ Connect and share in new ways with Windows Live. http://www.windowslive.com/share.html?ocid=TXT_TAGHM_Wave2_sharelife_012008 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.uueugene.org/pipermail/access/attachments/20080206/df8e4b55/attachment.html From Rev.D.Gilmartin at comcast.net Thu Feb 7 01:55:14 2008 From: Rev.D.Gilmartin at comcast.net (David Gilmartin) Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2008 23:55:14 -0800 Subject: [Access] job opening Message-ID: <60823026-4CE6-4218-ABC9-03A799D72584@comcast.net> Were you aware that LILA is looking for a new Executive Director. I saw this add in the Register Guard: 3118418 - Lane Independent Living Executive Director for fast-growing nonprofit empowering people with disabilities to live independently. Most staff and board have disabilities. Excellent skills in fiscal and operational management, leadership building, public speaking, community partnering, managing grants and contracts, setting timelines, resource development. Need positive management style. Full-time, minimum $40,000 salary, health insurance. Email letter, resume by February 18: jwest at lilaoregon.org David G. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.uueugene.org/pipermail/access/attachments/20080206/9dad69f2/attachment.html From leslie_gilbert at msn.com Thu Feb 7 03:44:34 2008 From: leslie_gilbert at msn.com (leslie gilbert) Date: Thu, 7 Feb 2008 01:44:34 -0800 Subject: [Access] job opening In-Reply-To: <60823026-4CE6-4218-ABC9-03A799D72584@comcast.net> References: <60823026-4CE6-4218-ABC9-03A799D72584@comcast.net> Message-ID: WOW really amazing. I used to work for them. From: Rev.D.Gilmartin at comcast.netTo: access at uueugene.orgDate: Wed, 6 Feb 2008 23:55:14 -0800Subject: [Access] job openingWere you aware that LILA is looking for a new Executive Director. I saw this add in the Register Guard: 3118418 - Lane Independent LivingExecutive Director for fast-growing nonprofit empowering people with disabilities to live independently. Most staff and board have disabilities. Excellent skills in fiscal and operational management, leadership building, public speaking, community partnering, managing grants and contracts, setting timelines, resource development. Need positive management style. Full-time, minimum $40,000 salary, health insurance. Email letter, resume by February 18: jwest at lilaoregon.org David G. _________________________________________________________________ Need to know the score, the latest news, or you need your Hotmail?-get your "fix". http://www.msnmobilefix.com/Default.aspx -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.uueugene.org/pipermail/access/attachments/20080207/fef1a621/attachment.html From Rev.D.Gilmartin at comcast.net Thu Feb 7 17:51:23 2008 From: Rev.D.Gilmartin at comcast.net (David Gilmartin) Date: Thu, 7 Feb 2008 15:51:23 -0800 Subject: [Access] accessibility surveys Message-ID: At the Accessibility Committee meeting Feb. 5th, we took a look at several accessibility surveys. There are three, with different approaches and amounts of information. We thought it made sense to make all three available through the accessibility pages of the UUCE website. And we thought it made sense to make copies of any or all of them available to committee members now, as email attachments, for some final review and tweaking, before putting them up on the website. If you want to see any or all of them, please let me know, and tell me which ones you want. 1. A survey, fairly simple, in narrative format, from the National Organization on Disability; 2. A survey of about 50 items in yes-no-comment format, updated from a survey several disabled UUs did for the Pacific Southwest District a few years ago. 3. ADA Checklist for Existing Facilities, copyright 1995 by Barrier Free Environments and Adaptive Environments Center. Lengthier and with more technical detail. Please let me know in the next day or two if you want to review any of these. I hope we can complete our reviews, make final changes, and pass them on to Martha by end of next week? David G. From maryotten at comcast.net Thu Feb 7 18:03:25 2008 From: maryotten at comcast.net (mary otten) Date: Thu, 07 Feb 2008 16:03:25 -0800 Subject: [Access] accessibility surveys In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20080208000325.maryotten@comcast.net> david, i'd like to see the first 2. an official ada check-list is not something i want to look at, as i figure it should be pretty complete. i think we should agree on one of these that will be the one we ask event planners to use, and my gut tells me the long one isn't it. these are volunteers! but that's just one person's opinion. mary ----- source message ----- from: David Gilmartin to: Milestones Joys Sorrows and Dreams Sharing of date: 2008/02/07 23:52:03 subject: [Access] accessibility surveys > > > At the Accessibility Committee meeting Feb. 5th, we took a look at > several accessibility surveys. There are three, with different > approaches and amounts of information. We thought it made sense to > make all three available through the accessibility pages of the UUCE > website. And we thought it made sense to make copies of any or all of > them available to committee members now, as email attachments, for > some final review and tweaking, before putting them up on the website. > If you want to see any or all of them, please let me know, and tell me > which ones you want. > > 1. A survey, fairly simple, in narrative format, from the National > Organization on Disability; > > 2. A survey of about 50 items in yes-no-comment format, updated from a > survey several disabled UU's did for the Pacific Southwest District a > few years ago. > > 3. ADA Checklist for Existing Facilities, copyright 1995 by Barrier > Free Environments and Adaptive Environments Center. Lengthier and with > more technical detail. > > Please let me know in the next day or two if you want to review any of > these. I hope we can complete our reviews, make final changes, and > pass them on to Martha by end of next week? > > David G. > _______________________________________________ > Access mailing list > Access at uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access From lucindap at comcast.net Thu Feb 7 18:42:53 2008 From: lucindap at comcast.net (Lucinda Pitcairn) Date: Thu, 07 Feb 2008 16:42:53 -0800 Subject: [Access] accessibility surveys In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <47ABA58D.3060904@comcast.net> David, I'd like to see the first two. It will be good to have them on the website. And it would be good to publicize that we have them. One way might be through the CC in March, maybe as an agenda item? Thanks for all the work you've done on this. Cindy David Gilmartin wrote: > At the Accessibility Committee meeting Feb. 5th, we took a look at > several accessibility surveys. There are three, with different > approaches and amounts of information. We thought it made sense to > make all three available through the accessibility pages of the UUCE > website. And we thought it made sense to make copies of any or all of > them available to committee members now, as email attachments, for > some final review and tweaking, before putting them up on the website. > If you want to see any or all of them, please let me know, and tell me > which ones you want. > > 1. A survey, fairly simple, in narrative format, from the National > Organization on Disability; > > 2. A survey of about 50 items in yes-no-comment format, updated from a > survey several disabled UUs did for the Pacific Southwest District a > few years ago. > > 3. ADA Checklist for Existing Facilities, copyright 1995 by Barrier > Free Environments and Adaptive Environments Center. Lengthier and with > more technical detail. > > Please let me know in the next day or two if you want to review any of > these. I hope we can complete our reviews, make final changes, and > pass them on to Martha by end of next week? > > David G. > _______________________________________________ > Access mailing list > Access at uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access > > > From mariah at efn.org Fri Feb 8 01:15:31 2008 From: mariah at efn.org (d. maria) Date: Thu, 7 Feb 2008 23:15:31 -0800 Subject: [Access] accessibility surveys In-Reply-To: <47ABA58D.3060904@comcast.net> References: <47ABA58D.3060904@comcast.net> Message-ID: me, three. On Feb 7, 2008, at 4:42 PM, Lucinda Pitcairn wrote: > David, > > I'd like to see the first two. It will be good to have them on the > website. And it would be good to publicize that we have them. One way > might be through the CC in March, maybe as an agenda item? > > Thanks for all the work you've done on this. > > Cindy > > David Gilmartin wrote: >> At the Accessibility Committee meeting Feb. 5th, we took a look at >> several accessibility surveys. There are three, with different >> approaches and amounts of information. We thought it made sense to >> make all three available through the accessibility pages of the UUCE >> website. And we thought it made sense to make copies of any or all of >> them available to committee members now, as email attachments, for >> some final review and tweaking, before putting them up on the website. >> If you want to see any or all of them, please let me know, and tell me >> which ones you want. >> >> 1. A survey, fairly simple, in narrative format, from the National >> Organization on Disability; >> >> 2. A survey of about 50 items in yes-no-comment format, updated from a >> survey several disabled UUs did for the Pacific Southwest District a >> few years ago. >> >> 3. ADA Checklist for Existing Facilities, copyright 1995 by Barrier >> Free Environments and Adaptive Environments Center. Lengthier and with >> more technical detail. >> >> Please let me know in the next day or two if you want to review any of >> these. I hope we can complete our reviews, make final changes, and >> pass them on to Martha by end of next week? >> >> David G. >> _______________________________________________ >> Access mailing list >> Access at uueugene.org >> http://www.uueugene.org >> http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access >> >> >> > _______________________________________________ > Access mailing list > Access at uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access > From lucindap at comcast.net Fri Feb 8 14:40:24 2008 From: lucindap at comcast.net (Lucinda Pitcairn) Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2008 12:40:24 -0800 Subject: [Access] Draft of minutes 2-05-08 for review Message-ID: <47ACBE38.30507@comcast.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.uueugene.org/pipermail/access/attachments/20080208/074b162c/attachment.html From webmaster at uueugene.org Fri Feb 8 22:50:06 2008 From: webmaster at uueugene.org (UUCE Webmaster) Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2008 20:50:06 -0800 Subject: [Access] accessibility surveys In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <88779889-FE3E-4815-B328-7C0BFB300F52@uueugene.org> I have to say I am very impressed with the quantity of work y'all are doing, AND the quality. This is good stuff!! I hope I can do you justice when time comes to put this on the website. Go TEAM! Martha O. webmaster On Feb 7, 2008, at 3:51 PM, David Gilmartin wrote: > At the Accessibility Committee meeting Feb. 5th, we took a look at > several accessibility surveys. There are three, with different > approaches and amounts of information. We thought it made sense to > make all three available through the accessibility pages of the > UUCE website. And we thought it made sense to make copies of any or > all of them available to committee members now, as email > attachments, for some final review and tweaking, before putting > them up on the website. If you want to see any or all of them, > please let me know, and tell me which ones you want. > > 1. A survey, fairly simple, in narrative format, from the National > Organization on Disability; > > 2. A survey of about 50 items in yes-no-comment format, updated > from a survey several disabled UUs did for the Pacific Southwest > District a few years ago. > > 3. ADA Checklist for Existing Facilities, copyright 1995 by Barrier > Free Environments and Adaptive Environments Center. Lengthier and > with more technical detail. > > Please let me know in the next day or two if you want to review any > of these. I hope we can complete our reviews, make final changes, > and pass them on to Martha by end of next week? > > David G. From algaelady at gmail.com Sat Feb 9 14:47:02 2008 From: algaelady at gmail.com (jeannemarie moore) Date: Sat, 9 Feb 2008 12:47:02 -0800 Subject: [Access] Draft of minutes 2-05-08 for review In-Reply-To: <47ACBE38.30507@comcast.net> References: <47ACBE38.30507@comcast.net> Message-ID: <003101c86b5c$ecca3fe0$6401a8c0@TheMachine> Hi all, I have submitted some things because, if this goes on the site the way it is, it will create questions. Even though a couple of things happened right AFTER the meeting, they are heads-up things and if they are not mentioned for another month, I propose that that might be problematic _____ From: access-bounces at uueugene.org [mailto:access-bounces at uueugene.org] On Behalf Of Lucinda Pitcairn Sent: Friday, February 08, 2008 12:40 PM To: Accessibility group Subject: [Access] Draft of minutes 2-05-08 for review Below is a draft of the minutes for our Tuesday meeting. Please let me know of your changes, additions, or comments by next Wednesday, the 13th. Many thanks! Cindy * * * DRAFT * * * Minutes of the Accessibility Committee Meeting Tuesday, February 5, 2008 Present: David Gilmartin, Jeanne-Marie Moore, Cindy Pitcairn, Fred Schultz Candle-lighting and a reading by Jeanne-Marie Moore , who dedicated the poem to Mary Otten, the co-chair of the committee. We had brief check-ins. Condolences were expressed for Mary Otten upon the loss of her mother. Fred Schultz's interest in the group was warmly welcomed. Secretary's Report: The minutes of the January meeting were approved via e-mail and put on our website. Notices of our monthly meetings and accessibility awareness tips are being published in the UUCE newsletter and electronically on UUpDate. Fun Church Events: Leslie Gilbert has contacted Phyllis Peara concerning plans for playing a version of the game Taboo after the third Friday potluck in April. David Gilmartin and Fred Schultz have volunteered to help with the set-up and materials for the game. *Jeanne-Marie has a conflict in April and is contacting Phyllis to see if the game night can be changed to May. Liaisons with Other Groups: Jeanne-Marie Moore reported that she had received no response to her request to represent accessibility issues on the Shared Values Subcommittee of the Building Project Oversight Committee. However, the next day after the meeting, she received a response encouraging accessibility issues to be discussed at the Listening Groups. This committee is closed for the time being. Jeanne-Marie said she would represent the group at the Coordinating Council meeting on Saturday. We discussed possible participation in the church talent show (also known as the "Music Soiree") on Saturday, March 15th. One possibility would be a reading by Jeanne-Marie of a funny piece about what it's like to communicate with a sighted person if you are blind, though that piece might be used at the game night instead. . General Discussion: An unrecognized accessibility issue was mentioned by Fred Schultz regarding people who may not be able, or do not want, to use computers. Awareness of this issue might help keep those people informed about important communications from the church. * Jeanne-Marie Moore mentioned the importance of letting people know that those with accessibility issues are now able to vote through a program developed by the Secretary of State's Office and the Help America Vote Act which a person with a disability can use at home on their own computer or go to the County Elections Office to vote privately and independently. Contact the County Elections Office: 682-4234 for further information. Accessibility Checklists: David Gilmartin has assembled three accessibility surveys, with different approaches and amounts of information, to be made available through the accessibility pages of the UUCE website. One is a fairly simple survey, in narrative format, from the National Organization on Disability. Another is a survey of about 50 items in a yes-no-comment format, updated from a survey created by the Pacific Southwest District a few years ago. The third one, which is lengthier and with more technical detail, is an "ADA Checklist for Existing Facilities," by the Barrier-Free Environments and Adaptive Environments Center. Conclusion: The next meeting is scheduled for Tuesday, March 4th, at 7 pm in the Sanctuary. The meeting was adjourned at 9 pm. Respectfully submitted, Cindy Pitcairn, Scribe -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.uueugene.org/pipermail/access/attachments/20080209/85062e5e/attachment.html From lucindap at comcast.net Sat Feb 9 23:52:58 2008 From: lucindap at comcast.net (Lucinda Pitcairn) Date: Sat, 09 Feb 2008 21:52:58 -0800 Subject: [Access] Draft of minutes 2-05-08 for review In-Reply-To: <003101c86b5c$ecca3fe0$6401a8c0@TheMachine> References: <47ACBE38.30507@comcast.net> <003101c86b5c$ecca3fe0$6401a8c0@TheMachine> Message-ID: <47AE913A.5030507@comcast.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.uueugene.org/pipermail/access/attachments/20080209/4496bb1f/attachment.html From Rev.D.Gilmartin at comcast.net Mon Feb 11 15:32:07 2008 From: Rev.D.Gilmartin at comcast.net (David Gilmartin) Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2008 13:32:07 -0800 Subject: [Access] accessibility surveys In-Reply-To: <20080208000325.maryotten@comcast.net> References: <20080208000325.maryotten@comcast.net> Message-ID: <442AA7B8-4C9F-4F43-9370-322B4D41CE3C@comcast.net> Mary, Though it must be a huge adjustment to go from learning of your mother's advanced cancer to her death in so short a space of time, I imagine it better than a prolonged period. And enough time for family to see her and say goodbyes probably helped everyone. I remember being startled, after my father died, to have him show up in my dreams, as alive as ever. I'm used to that now, but, for some reason, I hadn't been expecting it. Will attach the two surveys you asked for below. I think #2 is the one we favored for asking event planners to use. But there seemed to be agreement that there was some value in making the other two available as well, for those who hate surveys and for those who like to have the technical information. #2 still needs a bit more polishing, but I think all the questions are there. David -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: NOD - Guide to Accessible Meetings Type: application/octet-stream Size: 34816 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.uueugene.org/pipermail/access/attachments/20080211/330f4206/attachment-0002.obj -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Accessibility Survey 2-9-08 Type: application/octet-stream Size: 61952 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.uueugene.org/pipermail/access/attachments/20080211/330f4206/attachment-0003.obj -------------- next part -------------- On Feb 7, 2008, at 4:03 PM, mary otten wrote: > david, > i'd like to see the first 2. an official ada check-list is not > something i want to look at, as i figure it should be pretty > complete. i think we should agree on one of these that will be the > one we ask event planners to use, and my gut tells me the long one > isn't it. these are volunteers! but that's just one person's opinion. > > mary > > ----- source message ----- > from: David Gilmartin > to: Milestones Joys Sorrows and Dreams Sharing of > > date: 2008/02/07 23:52:03 > subject: [Access] accessibility surveys > >> >> >> At the Accessibility Committee meeting Feb. 5th, we took a look at >> several accessibility surveys. There are three, with different >> approaches and amounts of information. We thought it made sense to >> make all three available through the accessibility pages of the UUCE >> website. And we thought it made sense to make copies of any or all of >> them available to committee members now, as email attachments, for >> some final review and tweaking, before putting them up on the >> website. >> If you want to see any or all of them, please let me know, and tell >> me >> which ones you want. >> >> 1. A survey, fairly simple, in narrative format, from the National >> Organization on Disability; >> >> 2. A survey of about 50 items in yes-no-comment format, updated >> from a >> survey several disabled UU's did for the Pacific Southwest District a >> few years ago. >> >> 3. ADA Checklist for Existing Facilities, copyright 1995 by Barrier >> Free Environments and Adaptive Environments Center. Lengthier and >> with >> more technical detail. >> >> Please let me know in the next day or two if you want to review any >> of >> these. I hope we can complete our reviews, make final changes, and >> pass them on to Martha by end of next week? >> >> David G. >> _______________________________________________ >> Access mailing list >> Access at uueugene.org >> http://www.uueugene.org >> http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access > _______________________________________________ > Access mailing list > Access at uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access From Rev.D.Gilmartin at comcast.net Mon Feb 11 15:34:49 2008 From: Rev.D.Gilmartin at comcast.net (David Gilmartin) Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2008 13:34:49 -0800 Subject: [Access] accessibility surveys In-Reply-To: <47ABA58D.3060904@comcast.net> References: <47ABA58D.3060904@comcast.net> Message-ID: <6A810D79-B59E-4FA8-BB16-8B183C997617@comcast.net> Here's the two. The second one is not entirely polished and finished, though it does have the corrections and additions from the meeting. David -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: NOD - Guide to Accessible Meetings Type: application/octet-stream Size: 34816 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.uueugene.org/pipermail/access/attachments/20080211/476fd58b/attachment-0002.obj -------------- next part -------------- -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Accessibility Survey 2-9-08 Type: application/octet-stream Size: 61952 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.uueugene.org/pipermail/access/attachments/20080211/476fd58b/attachment-0003.obj -------------- next part -------------- On Feb 7, 2008, at 4:42 PM, Lucinda Pitcairn wrote: > David, > > I'd like to see the first two. It will be good to have them on the > website. And it would be good to publicize that we have them. One way > might be through the CC in March, maybe as an agenda item? > > Thanks for all the work you've done on this. > > Cindy > > David Gilmartin wrote: >> At the Accessibility Committee meeting Feb. 5th, we took a look at >> several accessibility surveys. There are three, with different >> approaches and amounts of information. We thought it made sense to >> make all three available through the accessibility pages of the UUCE >> website. And we thought it made sense to make copies of any or all of >> them available to committee members now, as email attachments, for >> some final review and tweaking, before putting them up on the >> website. >> If you want to see any or all of them, please let me know, and tell >> me >> which ones you want. >> >> 1. A survey, fairly simple, in narrative format, from the National >> Organization on Disability; >> >> 2. A survey of about 50 items in yes-no-comment format, updated >> from a >> survey several disabled UUs did for the Pacific Southwest District a >> few years ago. >> >> 3. ADA Checklist for Existing Facilities, copyright 1995 by Barrier >> Free Environments and Adaptive Environments Center. Lengthier and >> with >> more technical detail. >> >> Please let me know in the next day or two if you want to review any >> of >> these. I hope we can complete our reviews, make final changes, and >> pass them on to Martha by end of next week? >> >> David G. >> _______________________________________________ >> Access mailing list >> Access at uueugene.org >> http://www.uueugene.org >> http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access >> >> >> > _______________________________________________ > Access mailing list > Access at uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access From Rev.D.Gilmartin at comcast.net Mon Feb 11 15:37:58 2008 From: Rev.D.Gilmartin at comcast.net (David Gilmartin) Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2008 13:37:58 -0800 Subject: [Access] accessibility surveys In-Reply-To: References: <47ABA58D.3060904@comcast.net> Message-ID: <7B08EE76-46FA-4A85-9D10-E546505501C7@comcast.net> maria, Sorry for a bit of delay in getting these out. Here are the two you requested. #2 still has a little editing and polishing to go before its ready for release. And I've sent a message to National Organization on Disability requesting permission to put theirs up on our website, since it is copyrighted. David -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: NOD - Guide to Accessible Meetings Type: application/octet-stream Size: 34816 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.uueugene.org/pipermail/access/attachments/20080211/48117f82/attachment-0002.obj -------------- next part -------------- -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Accessibility Survey 2-9-08 Type: application/octet-stream Size: 61952 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.uueugene.org/pipermail/access/attachments/20080211/48117f82/attachment-0003.obj -------------- next part -------------- On Feb 7, 2008, at 11:15 PM, d. maria wrote: > me, three. > On Feb 7, 2008, at 4:42 PM, Lucinda Pitcairn wrote: > >> David, >> >> I'd like to see the first two. It will be good to have them on the >> website. And it would be good to publicize that we have them. One way >> might be through the CC in March, maybe as an agenda item? >> >> Thanks for all the work you've done on this. >> >> Cindy >> >> David Gilmartin wrote: >>> At the Accessibility Committee meeting Feb. 5th, we took a look at >>> several accessibility surveys. There are three, with different >>> approaches and amounts of information. We thought it made sense to >>> make all three available through the accessibility pages of the UUCE >>> website. And we thought it made sense to make copies of any or all >>> of >>> them available to committee members now, as email attachments, for >>> some final review and tweaking, before putting them up on the >>> website. >>> If you want to see any or all of them, please let me know, and >>> tell me >>> which ones you want. >>> >>> 1. A survey, fairly simple, in narrative format, from the National >>> Organization on Disability; >>> >>> 2. A survey of about 50 items in yes-no-comment format, updated >>> from a >>> survey several disabled UUs did for the Pacific Southwest District a >>> few years ago. >>> >>> 3. ADA Checklist for Existing Facilities, copyright 1995 by Barrier >>> Free Environments and Adaptive Environments Center. Lengthier and >>> with >>> more technical detail. >>> >>> Please let me know in the next day or two if you want to review >>> any of >>> these. I hope we can complete our reviews, make final changes, and >>> pass them on to Martha by end of next week? >>> >>> David G. >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Access mailing list >>> Access at uueugene.org >>> http://www.uueugene.org >>> http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access >>> >>> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> Access mailing list >> Access at uueugene.org >> http://www.uueugene.org >> http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access >> > > _______________________________________________ > Access mailing list > Access at uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access From Rev.D.Gilmartin at comcast.net Mon Feb 11 15:50:10 2008 From: Rev.D.Gilmartin at comcast.net (David Gilmartin) Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2008 13:50:10 -0800 Subject: [Access] Draft of minutes 2-05-08 for review In-Reply-To: <47ACBE38.30507@comcast.net> References: <47ACBE38.30507@comcast.net> Message-ID: <9074343C-CD78-46CE-AC06-B5782D0D2B57@comcast.net> Cindy, I thought Jeanne-Marie's comments, though they "officially" were about after-the-meeting happenings, made sense to try to include somehow. How is the question. A post-script?? An addenda?? In the body of the minutes, perhaps identified by use of italics or something? What have you thought about doing with them? David On Feb 8, 2008, at 12:40 PM, Lucinda Pitcairn wrote: > Below is a draft of the minutes for our Tuesday meeting. Please let > me know of your changes, additions, or comments by next Wednesday, > the 13th. Many thanks! Cindy > > * * * DRAFT * * * > > > Minutes of the Accessibility Committee Meeting > Tuesday, February 5, 2008 > Present: David Gilmartin, Jeanne-Marie Moore, Cindy Pitcairn, Fred > Schultz > Candle-lighting and a reading by Jeanne-Marie Moore were followed by > brief check-ins. Condolences were expressed for Mary Otten upon the > loss of her mother. Fred Schultz's interest in the group was warmly > welcomed. > Secretary's Report: The minutes of the January meeting were approved > via e-mail and put on our website. Notices of our monthly meetings > and accessibility awareness tips are being published in the UUCE > newsletter and electronically on UUpDate. > Fun Church Events: Leslie Gilbert has contacted Phyllis Peara > concerning plans for playing a version of the game Taboo after the > third Friday potluck in April. David Gilmartin and Fred Schultz have > volunteered to help with the set-up and materials for the game. > Liaisons with Other Groups: Jeanne-Marie Moore reported that she had > received no response to her request to represent accessibility > issues on the Shared Values Subcommittee of the Building Project > Oversight Committee. > Jeanne-Marie said she would represent the Accessibility Committee > group at the Coordinating Council meeting on Saturday. > We discussed possible participation in the church talent show (also > known as the "Music Soiree") on Saturday, March 15th. One > possibility would be a reading by Jeanne-Marie of a funny piece > about misunderstandings that sighted people have about the blind. > General Discussion: > An unrecognized accessibility issue was mentioned by Fred Schultz > regarding people who may not be able, or do not want, to use > computers. Awareness of this issue might help keep those people > informed about important communications from the church. I'm thinking this was the issue re letting people know of meeting changes by phone, rather than email, if that is their preference. Is that correct? If it is, I think the minutes would be improved by saying what the issue is and our recommendation for dealing with it. > Jeanne-Marie Moore mentioned the importance of letting people know > that those with accessibility issues are now able to vote in private > through an Oregon-sponsored > a government-sponsored program that makes use of voice-recognition > software. > Accessibility Checklists: David Gilmartin has assembled three > accessibility surveys, with different approaches and amounts of > information, to be made available through the accessibility pages of > the UUCE website. One is a fairly simple survey, in narrative > format, from the National Organization on Disability. Another is a > survey of about 50 items in a yes-no-comment format, updated from a > survey created by the Pacific Southwest District a few years ago. > The third one, which is lengthier and with more technical detail, is > an "ADA Checklist for Existing Facilities," by the Barrier-Free > Environments and Adaptive Environments Center. > Conclusion: The next meeting is scheduled for Tuesday, March 4th, at > 7 pm in the Sanctuary. The meeting was adjourned at 9 pm. > > Respectfully submitted, > > Cindy Pitcairn, Scribe > > _______________________________________________ > Access mailing list > Access at uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.uueugene.org/pipermail/access/attachments/20080211/fe766de6/attachment.html From Rev.D.Gilmartin at comcast.net Mon Feb 11 16:00:42 2008 From: Rev.D.Gilmartin at comcast.net (David Gilmartin) Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2008 14:00:42 -0800 Subject: [Access] Apologies for copying everyone In-Reply-To: <9074343C-CD78-46CE-AC06-B5782D0D2B57@comcast.net> References: <47ACBE38.30507@comcast.net> <9074343C-CD78-46CE-AC06-B5782D0D2B57@comcast.net> Message-ID: <28402AFC-7A03-4177-A481-7B0C8CF27A0B@comcast.net> Whoops! I meant for this flurry of emails to go just to individuals, not to the whole committee list. Sorry, everyone. David From maryotten at earthlink.net Mon Feb 11 17:59:15 2008 From: maryotten at earthlink.net (Mary Otten) Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2008 15:59:15 -0800 Subject: [Access] scheduling yet again In-Reply-To: <6A810D79-B59E-4FA8-BB16-8B183C997617@comcast.net> Message-ID: Hi folks, It seems that the next running of the rev's Channing class will happen in the evening on 4 March, so we will not get to use the sanctuary. Jeanne-marie alertly caught that; I did not. Per her corespondendce with Kim, it appears that room 2, downstairs, is available. We could also try the library or the social hall, but I doubt either will work, because the rev will be talking, perhaps using the mic, so I think we will have to meet downstairs that night. I hope that's ok with folks. I don't see where we have an option. Thanks to JM for catching this, and I'm sorry that we didn't get notified officially and had to depend on her to catch it. Unless I hear otherwise by tomorrow, I'm going to tell Kim to go ahead and put us in for room 2, or JM can do so. We don't want that room to get away from us. mary From maryotten at earthlink.net Mon Feb 11 18:57:25 2008 From: maryotten at earthlink.net (Mary Otten) Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2008 16:57:25 -0800 Subject: [Access] brezeway room In-Reply-To: <6A810D79-B59E-4FA8-BB16-8B183C997617@comcast.net> Message-ID: Hi folks, Do any of the wheelchair users on the list know if the breezeway room is accessible to people who use wheel-chairs? anybody else may speak up too, but only if you're confident in the answer, because I'd hate to schedule something there and then find out that our members who use wheel-chairs can not get in! mary From lucindap at comcast.net Mon Feb 11 19:41:57 2008 From: lucindap at comcast.net (Lucinda Pitcairn) Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2008 17:41:57 -0800 Subject: [Access] brezeway room In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <47B0F965.5030407@comcast.net> Mary, I'm pretty sure it is for a power chair, not so sure about a manual. Cindy Mary Otten wrote: > Hi folks, > Do any of the wheelchair users on the list know if the breezeway room > is accessible to people who use wheel-chairs? anybody else may speak up > too, but only if you're confident in the answer, because I'd hate to > schedule something there and then find out that our members who use > wheel-chairs can not get in! > > mary > > _______________________________________________ > Access mailing list > Access at uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access > > > From maryotten at earthlink.net Mon Feb 11 20:13:35 2008 From: maryotten at earthlink.net (Mary Otten) Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2008 18:13:35 -0800 Subject: [Access] brezeway room In-Reply-To: <47B0F965.5030407@comcast.net> Message-ID: Hi cindy, For my own education, what would make something inaccessible to a manual chair but accesible to a power chair? My intuition would have been that something might be accessible to a manual but not a power, because of the size of the later. Maybe power chairs can manage threshholds that would be hard for somebody using a manual chair? Educate the ignorant, if you would, please. mary From lucindap at comcast.net Mon Feb 11 20:39:57 2008 From: lucindap at comcast.net (Lucinda Pitcairn) Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2008 18:39:57 -0800 Subject: [Access] brezeway room In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <47B106FD.30203@comcast.net> Hi Mary, A short steep ramp leading to a threshhold would be harder for a manual chair, I think, because of the arm power needed to get up the ramp. On the other hand, a threshhold 1" high or more would be hard for a power chair to cross (mine can't get into the church office, for example) whereas a manual chair, being lighter and easier to tilt, might be able to make it. I'm not an expert on these matters, however, and note that some power chairs are more rugged than others and some manuals are lighter and more flexible than others. And, of course, the chair occupant can vary in strength. (Aren't you glad you asked? ;-) ) Cindy Mary Otten wrote: > Hi cindy, > For my own education, what would make something inaccessible to a > manual chair but accesible to a power chair? My intuition would have > been that something might be accessible to a manual but not a power, > because of the size of the later. Maybe power chairs can manage > threshholds that would be hard for somebody using a manual chair? > Educate the ignorant, if you would, please. > > mary > > _______________________________________________ > Access mailing list > Access at uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access > > > From maryotten at earthlink.net Mon Feb 11 21:45:13 2008 From: maryotten at earthlink.net (Mary Otten) Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2008 19:45:13 -0800 Subject: [Access] brezeway room In-Reply-To: <47B106FD.30203@comcast.net> Message-ID: Thanks, Cindy, for the helpful info. So, I hope Leslie is on the list and will let us know if that room is accessible, or perhaps, from that description, Ken, could you comment on the entrance to and lead up to the breezeway room? mary From Rev.D.Gilmartin at comcast.net Mon Feb 11 23:21:18 2008 From: Rev.D.Gilmartin at comcast.net (David Gilmartin) Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2008 21:21:18 -0800 Subject: [Access] Accessibility Games, May 16th In-Reply-To: <006f01c86d31$3d143a20$6401a8c0@TheMachine> References: <005001c86c43$152a1ff0$6401a8c0@TheMachine> <726043.96669.qm@web53006.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <006f01c86d31$3d143a20$6401a8c0@TheMachine> Message-ID: <304DED33-8D64-4532-9ACE-D753C576CA44@comcast.net> For any Studs Terkel lurkers and lovers, May 16th is Studs' birthday!! (Born in 1912) David G. On Feb 11, 2008, at 8:39 PM, jeannemarie moore wrote: > Thanks, Phyllis... > We'll accept yur gracious flexibility and would love May! > Thanks! > > j-m. > > > > From: Edgar and Phyllis Peara [mailto:pearaep at yahoo.com] > Sent: Monday, February 11, 2008 4:09 PM > To: algaelady at gmail.com > Subject: Re: Change our Our potluck game night? > > Hi, Of course you can have May! Sorry to be slow replying; I > didn't look at my messages promptly. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.uueugene.org/pipermail/access/attachments/20080211/932c1bae/attachment.html From Rev.D.Gilmartin at comcast.net Mon Feb 11 23:22:19 2008 From: Rev.D.Gilmartin at comcast.net (David Gilmartin) Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2008 21:22:19 -0800 Subject: [Access] Change list name? Message-ID: Martha, (and access list participants): I don't know if this is accident or deliberate, but I notice that when I type in the email address for the accessibility group, my screen shows it as: "Milestones Joys Sorrows and Dreams Sharing of " I find that slightly confusing when it comes up, since Share starts the same way. What about a different list name? What about: "Access Issues and Discussion " Comments, anyone? David G. From maryotten at comcast.net Mon Feb 11 23:43:27 2008 From: maryotten at comcast.net (mary otten) Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2008 21:43:27 -0800 Subject: [Access] Change list name? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20080212054327.maryotten@comcast.net> mine doesn't do that. it may be something with your set up. i don't know why yours would and mine not. mary ----- source message ----- from: David Gilmartin to: Osgood Martha , Milestones Joys Sorrows and Dreams Sharing of date: 2008/02/12 05:27:52 subject: [Access] Change list name? > > > Martha, (and access list participants): > > I don't know if this is accident or deliberate, but I notice that when > I type in the email address for the accessibility group, my screen > shows it as: > > "Milestones Joys Sorrows and Dreams Sharing of " > > I find that slightly confusing when it comes up, since Share starts > the same way. What about a different list name? What about: > > "Access Issues and Discussion " > > Comments, anyone? > > David G. > _______________________________________________ > Access mailing list > Access at uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access From ruthken at pacinfo.com Mon Feb 11 23:47:41 2008 From: ruthken at pacinfo.com (Ken Ross) Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2008 21:47:41 -0800 Subject: [Access] brezeway room In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Howdy, I'm going by church tomorrow morning, so if you can wait until I get back to email tomorrow afternoon, I can report. I would look at the threshold and take my handy ultra-lightweight measuring tape to see how wide the door is. I'm optimistic, because I would think such matters would have been taken into account four years ago, even though we didn't have an Accessibility Committee then. Anyway, let me know. Ken >Thanks, Cindy, for the helpful info. So, I hope Leslie is on the list >and will let us know if that room is accessible, or perhaps, from that >description, Ken, could you comment on the entrance to and lead up to >the breezeway room? > >mary > >_______________________________________________ >Access mailing list >Access at uueugene.org >http://www.uueugene.org >http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access -- **************************************************** Ken Ross ruthken at pacinfo.com home phone: 541-686-1549 ******************************************************* From mariah at efn.org Tue Feb 12 01:51:47 2008 From: mariah at efn.org (d. maria) Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2008 23:51:47 -0800 Subject: [Access] scheduling yet again In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I have an idea. How about we schedule the breezeway room, then if the threshold proves daunting we can take chairs for those of us without our own, into Room #2... which rarely is used for meetings as it has no adult chairs, assuming the threshold there is better. dm On Feb 11, 2008, at 3:59 PM, Mary Otten wrote: > Hi folks, > It seems that the next running of the rev's Channing class will happen > in the evening on 4 March, so we will not get to use the sanctuary. > Jeanne-marie alertly caught that; I did not. Per her corespondendce > with Kim, it appears that room 2, downstairs, is available. We could > also try the library or the social hall, but I doubt either will work, > because the rev will be talking, perhaps using the mic, so I think we > will have to meet downstairs that night. I hope that's ok with folks. I > don't see where we have an option. Thanks to JM for catching this, and > I'm sorry that we didn't get notified officially and had to depend on > her to catch it. Unless I hear otherwise by tomorrow, I'm going to > tell Kim to go ahead and put us in for room 2, or JM can do so. We > don't want that room to get away from us. > > mary > > _______________________________________________ > Access mailing list > Access at uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access > From ruthken at pacinfo.com Tue Feb 12 09:06:58 2008 From: ruthken at pacinfo.com (Ken Ross) Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2008 07:06:58 -0800 Subject: [Access] scheduling yet again In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: maria, I'll check it (the breezeway room) out this morning and get back to y'all this afternoon. Ken >I have an idea. How about we schedule the breezeway room, then if the >threshold proves daunting we can take chairs for those of us without >our own, into Room #2... which rarely is used for meetings as it has no >adult chairs, assuming the threshold there is better. dm > >On Feb 11, 2008, at 3:59 PM, Mary Otten wrote: > >> Hi folks, >> It seems that the next running of the rev's Channing class will happen >> in the evening on 4 March, so we will not get to use the sanctuary. >> Jeanne-marie alertly caught that; I did not. Per her corespondendce >> with Kim, it appears that room 2, downstairs, is available. We could >> also try the library or the social hall, but I doubt either will work, >> because the rev will be talking, perhaps using the mic, so I think we >> will have to meet downstairs that night. I hope that's ok with folks. I >> don't see where we have an option. Thanks to JM for catching this, and >> I'm sorry that we didn't get notified officially and had to depend on >> her to catch it. Unless I hear otherwise by tomorrow, I'm going to >> tell Kim to go ahead and put us in for room 2, or JM can do so. We >> don't want that room to get away from us. >> >> mary >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Access mailing list >> Access at uueugene.org >> http://www.uueugene.org >> http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access >> > >_______________________________________________ >Access mailing list >Access at uueugene.org >http://www.uueugene.org >http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access -- **************************************************** Ken Ross ruthken at pacinfo.com home phone: 541-686-1549 ******************************************************* From maryotten at earthlink.net Tue Feb 12 09:50:23 2008 From: maryotten at earthlink.net (Mary Otten) Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2008 07:50:23 -0800 Subject: [Access] brezeway room In-Reply-To: Message-ID: thanks, Ken; please do let us know your findings, and I or JM will bok the room if it looks good. Mary From lucindap at comcast.net Tue Feb 12 11:39:56 2008 From: lucindap at comcast.net (Lucinda Pitcairn) Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2008 09:39:56 -0800 Subject: [Access] scheduling yet again In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <47B1D9EC.4090208@comcast.net> sounds good to me. Cindy d. maria wrote: > I have an idea. How about we schedule the breezeway room, then if the > threshold proves daunting we can take chairs for those of us without > our own, into Room #2... which rarely is used for meetings as it has no > adult chairs, assuming the threshold there is better. dm > > From algaelady at gmail.com Tue Feb 12 12:23:44 2008 From: algaelady at gmail.com (jeannemarie moore) Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2008 10:23:44 -0800 Subject: [Access] Change list name? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <003e01c86da4$678eb910$6401a8c0@TheMachine> On target: let's change it. j-m. -----Original Message----- From: access-bounces at uueugene.org [mailto:access-bounces at uueugene.org] On Behalf Of David Gilmartin Sent: Monday, February 11, 2008 9:22 PM To: Osgood Martha; Milestones Joys Sorrows and Dreams Sharing of Subject: [Access] Change list name? Martha, (and access list participants): I don't know if this is accident or deliberate, but I notice that when I type in the email address for the accessibility group, my screen shows it as: "Milestones Joys Sorrows and Dreams Sharing of " I find that slightly confusing when it comes up, since Share starts the same way. What about a different list name? What about: "Access Issues and Discussion " Comments, anyone? David G. _______________________________________________ Access mailing list Access at uueugene.org http://www.uueugene.org http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access From leslie_gilbert at msn.com Tue Feb 12 18:27:42 2008 From: leslie_gilbert at msn.com (leslie gilbert) Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2008 16:27:42 -0800 Subject: [Access] brezeway room In-Reply-To: <47B106FD.30203@comcast.net> References: <47B106FD.30203@comcast.net> Message-ID: Yes Cindy's right that a sharp incline is okay for many power chairs but not manual ones. > Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2008 18:39:57 -0800> From: lucindap at comcast.net> To: access at uueugene.org> Subject: Re: [Access] brezeway room> > Hi Mary,> > A short steep ramp leading to a threshhold would be harder for a manual > chair, I think, because of the arm power needed to get up the ramp.> On the other hand, a threshhold 1" high or more would be hard for a > power chair to cross (mine can't get into the church office, for > example) whereas a manual chair, being lighter and easier to tilt, might > be able to make it.> > I'm not an expert on these matters, however, and note that some power > chairs are more rugged than others and some manuals are lighter and more > flexible than others. And, of course, the chair occupant can vary in > strength. (Aren't you glad you asked? ;-) ) Cindy> > > > Mary Otten wrote:> > Hi cindy,> > For my own education, what would make something inaccessible to a> > manual chair but accesible to a power chair? My intuition would have> > been that something might be accessible to a manual but not a power,> > because of the size of the later. Maybe power chairs can manage> > threshholds that would be hard for somebody using a manual chair?> > Educate the ignorant, if you would, please.> >> > mary> >> > _______________________________________________> > Access mailing list> > Access at uueugene.org> > http://www.uueugene.org> > http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access> >> >> > > _______________________________________________> Access mailing list> Access at uueugene.org> http://www.uueugene.org> http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access _________________________________________________________________ Climb to the top of the charts!?Play the word scramble challenge with star power. http://club.live.com/star_shuffle.aspx?icid=starshuffle_wlmailtextlink_jan -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.uueugene.org/pipermail/access/attachments/20080212/7b7925ae/attachment.html From leslie_gilbert at msn.com Tue Feb 12 18:25:03 2008 From: leslie_gilbert at msn.com (leslie gilbert) Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2008 16:25:03 -0800 Subject: [Access] brezeway room In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I'm pretty sure I've used that room before and did okay.> Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2008 21:47:41 -0800> To: access at uueugene.org> From: ruthken at pacinfo.com> Subject: Re: [Access] brezeway room> > Howdy,> > I'm going by church tomorrow morning, so if you can wait until I get > back to email tomorrow afternoon, I can report. I would look at the > threshold and take my handy ultra-lightweight measuring tape to see > how wide the door is. I'm optimistic, because I would think such > matters would have been taken into account four years ago, even > though we didn't have an Accessibility Committee then. Anyway, let > me know. Ken> > >Thanks, Cindy, for the helpful info. So, I hope Leslie is on the list> >and will let us know if that room is accessible, or perhaps, from that> >description, Ken, could you comment on the entrance to and lead up to> >the breezeway room?> >> >mary> >> >_______________________________________________> >Access mailing list> >Access at uueugene.org> >http://www.uueugene.org> >http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access> > > -- > ****************************************************> Ken Ross> ruthken at pacinfo.com> home phone: 541-686-1549> *******************************************************> _______________________________________________> Access mailing list> Access at uueugene.org> http://www.uueugene.org> http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access _________________________________________________________________ Helping your favorite cause is as easy as instant messaging.?You IM, we give. http://im.live.com/Messenger/IM/Home/?source=text_hotmail_join -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.uueugene.org/pipermail/access/attachments/20080212/3bda4f3c/attachment.html From ruthken at pacinfo.com Tue Feb 12 18:35:05 2008 From: ruthken at pacinfo.com (Ken Ross) Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2008 16:35:05 -0800 Subject: [Access] Breezeway Room and accessibility Message-ID: Accessibility Folks, The threshold to the Breezeway Room looks accessible to me, but I'm not an expert. There's a rounded one-half inch rise going in. There's a non-rounded one-inch rise going out. The doorway is 34 inches wide, which is wider than any other door in the church that I've had reason to measure. Ken -- **************************************************** Ken Ross ruthken at pacinfo.com home phone: 541-686-1549 ******************************************************* From webmaster at uueugene.org Tue Feb 12 21:22:44 2008 From: webmaster at uueugene.org (UUCE Webmaster) Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2008 19:22:44 -0800 Subject: [Access] Change list name? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi David, Go to your Mail program and under Window, find Previous Recipients. Do a Find (upper right hand corner) on "access". You may have more than one version, but I'll bet the first one is the one with the odd beginning. Delete it and all the other "access" entries. Now you can go to your address book and add in the proper address there. That should cure it. You're welcome :) Martha On Feb 11, 2008, at 9:22 PM, David Gilmartin wrote: > Martha, (and access list participants): > > I don't know if this is accident or deliberate, but I notice that > when I type in the email address for the accessibility group, my > screen shows it as: > > "Milestones Joys Sorrows and Dreams Sharing of " > > I find that slightly confusing when it comes up, since Share starts > the same way. What about a different list name? What about: > > "Access Issues and Discussion " > > Comments, anyone? > > David G. From maryotten at earthlink.net Wed Feb 13 11:51:15 2008 From: maryotten at earthlink.net (mary otten) Date: Wed, 13 Feb 2008 09:51:15 -0800 Subject: [Access] breezeway room is set Message-ID: <20080213175115.maryotten@earthlink.net> hi folks, having heard from cindy that she believes she will be ok with the threshhold to the breezeway room, i have scheduled our next meeting for that room. if we get there and anybody using a mobility device looks and decides they don't think they can do it after all, we'll just have to relocate downstairs to room 2. mary From mariah at efn.org Wed Feb 13 17:27:23 2008 From: mariah at efn.org (d. maria) Date: Wed, 13 Feb 2008 15:27:23 -0800 Subject: [Access] breezeway room is set In-Reply-To: <20080213175115.maryotten@earthlink.net> References: <20080213175115.maryotten@earthlink.net> Message-ID: ... and those of us without our own chairs can get one from the breezeway room. works for me. dm On Feb 13, 2008, at 9:51 AM, mary otten wrote: > hi folks, > having heard from cindy that she believes she will be ok with the > threshhold to the breezeway room, i have scheduled our next meeting > for that room. if we get there and anybody using a mobility device > looks and decides they don't think they can do it after all, we'll > just have to relocate downstairs to room 2. > > mary > _______________________________________________ > Access mailing list > Access at uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access > From maryotten at earthlink.net Wed Feb 13 19:48:23 2008 From: maryotten at earthlink.net (Mary Otten) Date: Wed, 13 Feb 2008 17:48:23 -0800 Subject: [Access] best laid plans Message-ID: Well, gee, it seems we mostly use this wonderful list serve to talk about schedules. How boring is that! When Kim went to update the calendar with our breezeway scheduling for March 4, she discovered its already booked. The RE committee, which has the breezeway scheduled, is willing to move if room 2 can't accommodate folks who use wheel-chairs. Does anybody know if all the downstairs class-room threshholds are the same? I know room 5 is accessible. We've met there already. How about room 2? If it is, I guess we meet there; maybe we can get Matt to bring down some adult-sized chairs for those of us with more than adult-sized posteriors. Mary From mariah at efn.org Thu Feb 14 01:46:19 2008 From: mariah at efn.org (d. maria) Date: Wed, 13 Feb 2008 23:46:19 -0800 Subject: [Access] best laid plans In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49d577bd2be09b60cc892ee3c10125f2@efn.org> I'm pretty certain of accessibility, and the lack of adult chairs. Matt would be good. How many do we need. Is Fred returning? And no metal folding chairs either, please. dm On Feb 13, 2008, at 5:48 PM, Mary Otten wrote: > Well, gee, it seems we mostly use this wonderful list serve to talk > about schedules. How boring is that! When Kim went to update the > calendar with our breezeway scheduling for March 4, she discovered its > already booked. The RE committee, which has the breezeway scheduled, is > willing to move if room 2 can't accommodate folks who use wheel-chairs. > Does anybody know if all the downstairs class-room threshholds are the > same? I know room 5 is accessible. We've met there already. How about > room 2? If it is, I guess we meet there; maybe we can get Matt to bring > down some adult-sized chairs for those of us with more than adult-sized > posteriors. > > Mary > > _______________________________________________ > Access mailing list > Access at uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access > From algaelady at gmail.com Thu Feb 14 14:53:01 2008 From: algaelady at gmail.com (jeannemarie moore) Date: Thu, 14 Feb 2008 12:53:01 -0800 Subject: [Access] interfaith conference re disability Message-ID: <001201c86f4b$96e92030$6401a8c0@TheMachine> SAVE THE DATE! May 2, 2008 INTERFAITH DISABILITIES NETWORK OF OREGON Hosts An Interfaith Conference for Clergy & Lay Leaders People with Disabilities Families of People with Disabilities Members of Congregations Professional Service Providers KEYNOTE SPEAKERS The Rev. Dr. Brett Webb-Mitchell The Rev. Charles Stephen Currie, Jr. Workshops & Exhibits Networking Opportunities CEU credits & Certificates of Attendance available Continental Breakfast & Lunch provided Early-bird Registration: $25 (scholarships available, please contact) St. Anthony Village - Portland, OR Friday, May 2, 2008 8:30AM - 4:00PM For Information & Registration contact idno at msn.com Interfaith Disabilities Network of Oregon 1130 SW Morrison, Suite 316 Portland, OR 97205 503-226-7079 ext.55 Email: idno at msn.com Mission Statement: The mission of IDNO is to activate the resources of faith communities to address the unmet needs of individuals with disabilities and their families in Oregon. Interfaith Disabilities Network of Oregon is a 501 (c) 3 organization. Jeanne-Marie From lucindap at comcast.net Thu Feb 14 15:40:50 2008 From: lucindap at comcast.net (Lucinda Pitcairn) Date: Thu, 14 Feb 2008 13:40:50 -0800 Subject: [Access] interfaith conference re disability In-Reply-To: <001201c86f4b$96e92030$6401a8c0@TheMachine> References: <001201c86f4b$96e92030$6401a8c0@TheMachine> Message-ID: <47B4B562.7080302@comcast.net> I hope some of us can participate in this! Thanks for sending it on, Jeanne-Marie. Cindy jeannemarie moore wrote: > SAVE THE DATE! > May 2, 2008 > > > INTERFAITH > DISABILITIES > NETWORK OF > OREGON > > Hosts > > > > > > > > > An Interfaith Conference for > Clergy & Lay Leaders > People with Disabilities > Families of People with Disabilities > Members of Congregations > Professional Service Providers > > KEYNOTE SPEAKERS > The Rev. Dr. Brett Webb-Mitchell > > The Rev. Charles Stephen Currie, Jr. > > Workshops & Exhibits > Networking Opportunities > CEU credits & Certificates of Attendance available > Continental Breakfast & Lunch provided > Early-bird Registration: $25 (scholarships available, please contact) > > St. Anthony Village - Portland, OR > Friday, May 2, 2008 > 8:30AM - 4:00PM > > For Information & Registration contact idno at msn.com > > Interfaith Disabilities Network of Oregon > 1130 SW Morrison, Suite 316 > Portland, OR 97205 > 503-226-7079 ext.55 > Email: idno at msn.com > > Mission Statement: The mission of IDNO is to activate the resources of > faith communities to address > the unmet needs of individuals with disabilities and their families in > Oregon. > Interfaith Disabilities Network of Oregon is a 501 (c) 3 organization. > > Jeanne-Marie > > > > _______________________________________________ > Access mailing list > Access at uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access > > > From lucindap at comcast.net Fri Feb 15 13:47:59 2008 From: lucindap at comcast.net (Lucinda Pitcairn) Date: Fri, 15 Feb 2008 11:47:59 -0800 Subject: [Access] Minutes of February meeting for posting on website Message-ID: <47B5EC6F.2080308@comcast.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.uueugene.org/pipermail/access/attachments/20080215/bb057bed/attachment.html From maryotten at earthlink.net Mon Feb 18 17:07:38 2008 From: maryotten at earthlink.net (mary otten) Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2008 15:07:38 -0800 Subject: [Access] march meeting Message-ID: <20080218230738.maryotten@earthlink.net> hi folks, its official. we will be in room 2on the 4th of march, and matt will bring half a dozen adult-sized chairs there for us. i'm looking for input for the agenda. since we have yet to discuss the accessibility lists that david offered, we may either do that via e-mail or we will have to do at the meeting. other topics could include any update from ken from facilities council as well as from the taboo night folks and any word on our budget request if anybody's got any news. other ideas? maryx From Rev.D.Gilmartin at comcast.net Mon Feb 18 17:31:52 2008 From: Rev.D.Gilmartin at comcast.net (David Gilmartin) Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2008 15:31:52 -0800 Subject: [Access] march meeting In-Reply-To: <20080218230738.maryotten@earthlink.net> References: <20080218230738.maryotten@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <0E56856E-A8EC-4AC1-8613-EFCD1735F4C6@comcast.net> Mary, I sent copies of the accessibility surveys to those who requested them, requesting feedback. To date, I have received suggestions back only from Cindy. I've been assuming that I would incorporate suggestions, then send the surveys to Martha for putting up on the website. Do you feel that another round of discussion/input/editing is necessary? Do you have some feedback or suggestions you want me to think about? (I'll incorporate Cindy's suggestions in the next day or so and send the revised edition around.) I've no word from anyone on our budget request at this time. But there's still two weeks before the meeting, so might hear, or could solicit feedback for the meeting as it gets closer. Cindy and I have a now and then thread of discussion which has to do with articulation of the accessibility goal(s) for the church, something that could go onto our accessibility pages. It's a discussion about the independent living philosophy, independence, interdependence... We haven't tried to write anything down yet. An interesting part of our discussions is about not recognizing invisible disabilities (e.g., back problems) or invisible accessibility/ communications barriers (e.g., not having sign language interpretation, not recognizing others may not understand English). Another: Cindy mentioned that the committee that Jeanne-Marie wanted to be on, having to do with values and new building, I think, but I don't remember name of the committee, is a "closed" committee. So may want to revisit and continue the discussion we've had about this. But I suggest you talk with Cindy about it to get a good background on the situation!! That's what I can think of now. David On Feb 18, 2008, at 3:07 PM, mary otten wrote: > hi folks, > its official. we will be in room 2on the 4th of march, and matt will > bring half a dozen adult-sized chairs there for us. i'm looking for > input for the agenda. since we have yet to discuss the accessibility > lists that david offered, we may either do that via e-mail or we > will have to do at the meeting. other topics could include any > update from ken from facilities council as well as from the taboo > night folks and any word on our budget request if anybody's got any > news. other ideas? > > maryx > _______________________________________________ > Access mailing list > Access at uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access From maryotten at earthlink.net Mon Feb 18 17:59:53 2008 From: maryotten at earthlink.net (mary otten) Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2008 15:59:53 -0800 Subject: [Access] march meeting In-Reply-To: <0E56856E-A8EC-4AC1-8613-EFCD1735F4C6@comcast.net> References: <20080218230738.maryotten@earthlink.net> <0E56856E-A8EC-4AC1-8613-EFCD1735F4C6@comcast.net> Message-ID: <20080218235953.maryotten@earthlink.net> no, i was not saying i think another round of discussion is required at the meeting. i was asking. to be honest, looking at those lists is on my list of things to do. and now that i'm actually able to carry on with normal activities throughout the day without needing to just give it up and sleep, i expect i'll get back to you with some input. the committee jm wanted to be on is not permanently closed. its closed right now, because they are in the middle of a process that they apparently feel would not benefit from somebody new joining at this time. it will open again. i think maybe the discussion you talked about having with cindy would be interesting if it were to be carried on on this listserv, but of course, that is your prerogative. the matter of asl interpretation is an interesting one. we have 2 professional interpreters that i know of who are members of our congregation. it would be great if we had enough such people so that we could have services and other big deal events interpreted as a matter of course. or it'd be great if we had lots of money and could pay both our members and outside interpreters the going rate for such services. i personally do not view not understanding english as a disability access issue unless the nonunderstanding is due to a disability. that's not to say its not an issue, just that it isn't ours to deal with imho. mary ----- source message ----- from: David Gilmartin to: Access Issues and Discussion date: 2008/02/18 23:32:20 subject: Re: [Access] march meeting > > > Mary, > > I sent copies of the accessibility surveys to those who requested > them, requesting feedback. To date, I have received suggestions back > only from Cindy. I've been assuming that I would incorporate > suggestions, then send the surveys to Martha for putting up on the > website. Do you feel that another round of discussion/input/editing is > necessary? Do you have some feedback or suggestions you want me to > think about? (I'll incorporate Cindy's suggestions in the next day or > so and send the revised edition around.) > > I've no word from anyone on our budget request at this time. But > there's still two weeks before the meeting, so might hear, or could > solicit feedback for the meeting as it gets closer. > > Cindy and I have a now and then thread of discussion which has to do > with articulation of the accessibility goal(s) for the church, > something that could go onto our accessibility pages. It's a > discussion about the independent living philosophy, independence, > interdependence... We haven't tried to write anything down yet. An > interesting part of our discussions is about not recognizing invisible > disabilities (e.g., back problems) or invisible accessibility/ > communications barriers (e.g., not having sign language > interpretation, not recognizing others may not understand English). > > Another: Cindy mentioned that the committee that Jeanne-Marie wanted > to be on, having to do with values and new building, I think, but I > don't remember name of the committee, is a "closed" committee. So may > want to revisit and continue the discussion we've had about this. But > I suggest you talk with Cindy about it to get a good background on the > situation!! > > That's what I can think of now. > > David > > > > On Feb 18, 2008, at 3:07 PM, mary otten wrote: > > > hi folks, > > its official. we will be in room 2on the 4th of march, and matt will > > bring half a dozen adult-sized chairs there for us. i'm looking for > > input for the agenda. since we have yet to discuss the accessibility > > lists that david offered, we may either do that via e-mail or we > > will have to do at the meeting. other topics could include any > > update from ken from facilities council as well as from the taboo > > night folks and any word on our budget request if anybody's got any > > news. other ideas? > > > > maryx > > _______________________________________________ > > Access mailing list > > Access at uueugene.org > > http://www.uueugene.org > > http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access > > _______________________________________________ > Access mailing list > Access at uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access From algaelady at gmail.com Mon Feb 18 21:44:46 2008 From: algaelady at gmail.com (jeannemarie moore) Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2008 19:44:46 -0800 Subject: [Access] march meeting In-Reply-To: <20080218235953.maryotten@earthlink.net> References: <20080218230738.maryotten@earthlink.net><0E56856E-A8EC-4AC1-8613-EFCD1735F4C6@comcast.net> <20080218235953.maryotten@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <006c01c872a9$c5c76e00$6401a8c0@TheMachine> Hi there, I agree with Mary: not understanding English is not an "access" issue for me. I also agree that we don't need to discuss the lists anymore. I think we need to discuss the guidelines I'm (hopefully) going to have finished about other than e-mail for notification of emergencies (calm calm it won't be overwhelming), and I think we need to discuss the game night in May... (Phyllis would LOVE ideas for the March and April potlucks if anyone has any...) and we need to talk about the podium. And the fact that some people are already saying "you don't expect the next church tobe fully accessible, do you really?" I sure as heck do, and think we need to write a position paper or something like that... some guideline. And also guidelines for things like classes, SMG's, etc. Enough? j-m. -----Original Message----- From: access-bounces at uueugene.org [mailto:access-bounces at uueugene.org] On Behalf Of mary otten Sent: Monday, February 18, 2008 4:00 PM To: access at uueugene.org Subject: Re: [Access] march meeting no, i was not saying i think another round of discussion is required at the meeting. i was asking. to be honest, looking at those lists is on my list of things to do. and now that i'm actually able to carry on with normal activities throughout the day without needing to just give it up and sleep, i expect i'll get back to you with some input. the committee jm wanted to be on is not permanently closed. its closed right now, because they are in the middle of a process that they apparently feel would not benefit from somebody new joining at this time. it will open again. i think maybe the discussion you talked about having with cindy would be interesting if it were to be carried on on this listserv, but of course, that is your prerogative. the matter of asl interpretation is an interesting one. we have 2 professional interpreters that i know of who are members of our congregation. it would be great if we had enough such people so that we could have services and other big deal events interpreted as a matter of course. or it'd be great if we had lots of money and could pay both our members and outside interpreters the going rate for such services. i personally do not view not understanding english as a disability access issue unless the nonunderstanding is due to a disability. that's not to say its not an issue, just that it isn't ours to deal with imho. mary ----- source message ----- from: David Gilmartin to: Access Issues and Discussion date: 2008/02/18 23:32:20 subject: Re: [Access] march meeting > > > Mary, > > I sent copies of the accessibility surveys to those who requested > them, requesting feedback. To date, I have received suggestions back > only from Cindy. I've been assuming that I would incorporate > suggestions, then send the surveys to Martha for putting up on the > website. Do you feel that another round of discussion/input/editing is > necessary? Do you have some feedback or suggestions you want me to > think about? (I'll incorporate Cindy's suggestions in the next day or > so and send the revised edition around.) > > I've no word from anyone on our budget request at this time. But > there's still two weeks before the meeting, so might hear, or could > solicit feedback for the meeting as it gets closer. > > Cindy and I have a now and then thread of discussion which has to do > with articulation of the accessibility goal(s) for the church, > something that could go onto our accessibility pages. It's a > discussion about the independent living philosophy, independence, > interdependence... We haven't tried to write anything down yet. An > interesting part of our discussions is about not recognizing invisible > disabilities (e.g., back problems) or invisible accessibility/ > communications barriers (e.g., not having sign language > interpretation, not recognizing others may not understand English). > > Another: Cindy mentioned that the committee that Jeanne-Marie wanted > to be on, having to do with values and new building, I think, but I > don't remember name of the committee, is a "closed" committee. So may > want to revisit and continue the discussion we've had about this. But > I suggest you talk with Cindy about it to get a good background on the > situation!! > > That's what I can think of now. > > David > > > > On Feb 18, 2008, at 3:07 PM, mary otten wrote: > > > hi folks, > > its official. we will be in room 2on the 4th of march, and matt will > > bring half a dozen adult-sized chairs there for us. i'm looking for > > input for the agenda. since we have yet to discuss the accessibility > > lists that david offered, we may either do that via e-mail or we > > will have to do at the meeting. other topics could include any > > update from ken from facilities council as well as from the taboo > > night folks and any word on our budget request if anybody's got any > > news. other ideas? > > > > maryx > > _______________________________________________ > > Access mailing list > > Access at uueugene.org > > http://www.uueugene.org > > http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access > > _______________________________________________ > Access mailing list > Access at uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access _______________________________________________ Access mailing list Access at uueugene.org http://www.uueugene.org http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access From maryotten at earthlink.net Mon Feb 18 22:24:36 2008 From: maryotten at earthlink.net (Mary Otten) Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2008 20:24:36 -0800 Subject: [Access] march meeting In-Reply-To: <006c01c872a9$c5c76e00$6401a8c0@TheMachine> Message-ID: I think we should be able to find allies in SJ regarding full accesibility of our new church home, especially if we don't buy an existing structure. Then again, that could mean its location would be not desirable from an access point of view. It will be interesting. mary From lucindap at comcast.net Tue Feb 19 00:19:06 2008 From: lucindap at comcast.net (Lucinda Pitcairn) Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2008 22:19:06 -0800 Subject: [Access] march meeting In-Reply-To: <20080218235953.maryotten@earthlink.net> References: <20080218230738.maryotten@earthlink.net> <0E56856E-A8EC-4AC1-8613-EFCD1735F4C6@comcast.net> <20080218235953.maryotten@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <47BA74DA.40102@comcast.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.uueugene.org/pipermail/access/attachments/20080218/41553bf0/attachment-0001.html From lucindap at comcast.net Tue Feb 19 00:20:56 2008 From: lucindap at comcast.net (Lucinda Pitcairn) Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2008 22:20:56 -0800 Subject: [Access] march meeting In-Reply-To: <20080218235953.maryotten@earthlink.net> References: <20080218230738.maryotten@earthlink.net> <0E56856E-A8EC-4AC1-8613-EFCD1735F4C6@comcast.net> <20080218235953.maryotten@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <47BA7548.1010908@comcast.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.uueugene.org/pipermail/access/attachments/20080218/e536f007/attachment.html From Rev.D.Gilmartin at comcast.net Tue Feb 19 22:49:49 2008 From: Rev.D.Gilmartin at comcast.net (David Gilmartin) Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2008 20:49:49 -0800 Subject: [Access] Survey (Revised) Message-ID: <86F0AB83-AB80-4A84-85AE-780A2A8BE7F3@comcast.net> Here's a final or near-final version of the Accessibility Survey we've been working on. Questions have been reworded, reordered, added, and taken out. Formatting has been tinkered with. I hope you will all give it a green light for going up on the web site, but if you have any quibbles, comments, suggestions, or critiques and want them considered before the survey is viewed by the wider world, please let me know ASAP. Thanks for giving this your time and attention. David -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Accessibility Survey.doc Type: application/octet-stream Size: 59904 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.uueugene.org/pipermail/access/attachments/20080219/a837776a/attachment-0001.obj -------------- next part -------------- From maryotten at earthlink.net Wed Feb 20 00:14:33 2008 From: maryotten at earthlink.net (Mary Otten) Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2008 22:14:33 -0800 Subject: [Access] Survey (Revised) In-Reply-To: <86F0AB83-AB80-4A84-85AE-780A2A8BE7F3@comcast.net> Message-ID: Hi David,Re question 28, why is limited hearing mentioned in a question having to do with light. what is the connection? In the questions about wheel-chair accessibility, you have some specific guidelines regarding heights, position of grab bars etc. In the low vision ones regarding light, there is nothing indicating what constitutes adequate. I don't know if such standards exist, honestly. but if they do, I think it would be good to include those as you have specified things for accessibility for folks who use wheel-chairs. I also don't understand question 25 regarding venting printers fax machines and computers to the outdoors> I've never heard of such a thing. Maybe it could be taken out? Also in the question that asks about all parts of a building being accessible to people who use wheel-chairs, I think that should be revised to ask about whether all parts of the building which will be used by the public. If this is the check list we want people to consider when looking at outside rental space, it is not relevant if certain parts that our people wouldn't use are not accessible, e.g. maybe there are offices that don't have accessible desks, but we won't be needing to use them. I think we could provide this list, minus the stuff about programs, policies and practices, as the check list for folks looking to rent outside facilities for church events, Tthe program practice and policy part does not seem relevant for them, since they are considering facilities, except the part about listening devices and amplification systems for the hearing impaired, so I think that should be included in the first part about the facility, not the part about the programs etc. What would guidance under question 48 look like? My first reaction is to say I don't even like that question. It feels like special consideration. How would it be to ask does your congregation provide guidance for, say people of color, or women, or glbtq people in services? Maybe I'm misunderstanding, but why should there be such guidance and what would it look like? I would suggest moving question 46 to the first part as it has to do with the facility, not a policy or program; its signage. Regarding alternative lighting, isn't there something about fluorescent lighting, dimmer switches or some new kind of lighting or something that makes them ok or at least better than they use to be. We just had a discussion at the accessibility committee of the HRC on this topic, but I don't remember the technical details. A fix is nontrivial. Sorry I'm late commenting on this. I'd love to hear what others think. Mary From Rev.D.Gilmartin at comcast.net Wed Feb 20 04:23:39 2008 From: Rev.D.Gilmartin at comcast.net (David Gilmartin) Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2008 02:23:39 -0800 Subject: [Access] Survey (Revised) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Mary, I've interleaved my responses to your comments in the message that follows. Hope they are helpful. Come on back with further comments if you want. David G. On Feb 19, 2008, at 10:14 PM, Mary Otten wrote: > Hi David,Re question 28, why is limited hearing mentioned in a > question having to do with light. what is the connection? Those with low hearing rely on lip reading to supplement what they do hear. Adequate lighting on the faces of those speaking assists in reading the lips of others. > In the > questions about wheel-chair accessibility, you have some specific > guidelines regarding heights, position of grab bars etc. In the low > vision ones regarding light, there is nothing indicating what > constitutes adequate. I don't know if such standards exist, honestly. > but if they do, I think it would be good to include those as you have > specified things for accessibility for folks who use wheel-chairs. I wondered about this too. Again, the issue is accessibility for those with low hearing. I will contact some of the organizations for people with hearing limitations and see if any of them have developed or know of measurable standards. If not, of course, one has to rely on the educated eyes and experience of those with the disability. > I also don't understand question 25 regarding venting printers fax > machines and computers to the outdoors> I've never heard of such a > thing. Maybe it could be taken out? The issue is of importance to people with chemical sensitivities. The outgassing from the plastics, circuit boards, and toner, in the absence of suitable and sufficient ventilation, are significant factors in "sick building syndrome" and many kinds of physical reactions to being in their vicinity. People also react to the electromagnetic fields, especially those generated by computers. > Also in the question that asks > about all parts of a building being accessible to people who use > wheel-chairs, I think that should be revised to ask about whether all > parts of the building which will be used by the public. If this is the > check list we want people to consider when looking at outside rental > space, it is not relevant if certain parts that our people wouldn't > use > are not accessible, e.g. maybe there are offices that don't have > accessible desks, but we won't be needing to use them. Good point. I will work on how that could be better worded. > I think we could provide this list, minus the stuff about programs, > policies and practices, as the check list for folks looking to rent > outside facilities for church events, The program practice and policy > part does not seem relevant for them, since they are considering > facilities, except the part about listening devices and amplification > systems for the hearing impaired, so I think that should be included > in the first part about the facility, not the part about the programs > etc. I put the listening devices questions in the "program, practice, and policy" part mainly because I think of them more like furnishings, not part of the physical plant itself. I suspect you are right that not all questions are of equal relevance, depending on the reason for the survey and the type of facility being evaluated. There would be quite different expectations regarding accessibility for a SMG meeting in someone's home, for example, compared to a pledge campaign kick-off dinner at Lane Community College. How important is it to design the questionnaire for each particular kind of use? > What would guidance under question 48 look like? My first reaction is > to say I don't even like that question. It feels like special > consideration. How would it be to ask does your congregation provide > guidance for, say people of color, or women, or glbtq people in > services? Maybe I'm misunderstanding, but why should there be such > guidance and what would it look like? "Guidance" could be a number of things. In our case, I think first of the statement in the church bylaws that says: 020.2 We covenant to affirm and promote the full participation of all persons in all our activities and endeavors-including membership, programming, hiring practices, and the calling of religious professionals-without stereotype based on race, color, gender, physical or mental disability, sexual orientation, gender identity, class, national origin, or political affiliation. Then there is the Board policy on accessibility that says: ACC.1 As far as possible, the church and its staff shall make reasonable accommodation in its programs and facilities to make all aspects and areas of the church accessible to members and others with disabilities. These accommodations may include facilities enhancements, alternate materials and publications, adaptive equipment and/or accommodations by staff. Another example that I found on the UUCE website is in the mission statement for the youth program, that includes: . . . UUYouth, advisors, and supporters strive to nurture one another by: . . . . ? providing developmentally appropriate activities and experiences that accommodate diverse learning styles. The guidance I see in these instances strikes me as "this is how we will do things" statements, not "this is the way you will do things." As such, I'm not riled by them. But you raise an interesting question, and it could be helpful to get some feedback on both the wording and the intent from some church members of color, or who are women, or glbtq. So let's solicit some opinions. > I would suggest moving question 46 to the first part as it has to do > with the facility, not a policy or program; its signage. Good catch, as Martha might say. > Regarding alternative lighting, isn't there something about > fluorescent > lighting, dimmer switches or some new kind of lighting or something > that makes them ok or at least better than they use to be. We just had > a discussion at the accessibility committee of the HRC on this topic, > but I don't remember the technical details. A fix is nontrivial. My discussions with people who are sensitive to electromagnetic radiation (EMR), plus reading on the subject, indicates that natural daylight is best, and that incandescent lighting is much better than either fluorescent or LED lighting. Fluorescent and LED lighting both require ballasts, which produce EMR. Fluorescent lights flicker and induce seizure activity in some people. When I think of a complete fix, I see the architectural provision of three systems of lighting -- natural, fluorescent or LED, and incandescent. Building in all three would involve extra expense, though those costs would be offset some by the savings in electricity usage over time. The much easier fix is to have a number of incandescent lamps that can be moved from room to room and used where needed, as needed. > Sorry I'm late commenting on this. I'd love to hear what others think. Stay tuned to this listserv and you will! > Mary David G. From KaeserR at earthlink.net Wed Feb 20 09:24:08 2008 From: KaeserR at earthlink.net (Robert Kaeser) Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2008 07:24:08 -0800 Subject: [Access] Survey (Revised) In-Reply-To: <86F0AB83-AB80-4A84-85AE-780A2A8BE7F3@comcast.net> References: <86F0AB83-AB80-4A84-85AE-780A2A8BE7F3@comcast.net> Message-ID: Hi David, You and your committee have done a remarkable job here and I would hope our new space would incorporate all of the recommendations. In fact that should be a priority. I do have one question. Items 20, 21, and k refer to incandescent lighting vs florescent vs daylight. Of course daylight, windows, etc are essential for ambience and mood. The older florescent lights had quite an annoying flicker which has been remedied by using phosphors with longer decay. Florescent lights are more energy efficient than incandescent as are the metal vapor lights. What is the advantage of incandescent lighting? Curious bob K At 08:49 PM 2/19/2008 -0800, you wrote: >Here's a final or near-final version of the Accessibility Survey we've >been working on. Questions have been reworded, reordered, added, and >taken out. Formatting has been tinkered with. I hope you will all give >it a green light for going up on the web site, but if you have any >quibbles, comments, suggestions, or critiques and want them considered >before the survey is viewed by the wider world, please let me know >ASAP. Thanks for giving this your time and attention. > >David "Science, for its progress, its understanding and so on, depends so much on truth and clarity. And the question is: Are we living in a society where truth and clarity are an important element of our culture?" --- I. I. Rabi From maryotten at comcast.net Wed Feb 20 12:24:38 2008 From: maryotten at comcast.net (mary otten) Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2008 10:24:38 -0800 Subject: [Access] Survey (Revised) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20080220182438.maryotten@comcast.net> hi david and all, thanks for your response to my comments. i'm not sure we need different checklists for each type of program, smg, church-wide event. but what i am sure of is that we don't want to give unnecessary questions to anybody who is just investigating a facility for our one-time use. there had been a request for such a checklist, and i'd like to provide it without extra stuff that the people doing the facility research may find intimidating. so i would still like the listening assistence stupp included in the first part. if you want it twice, i guess that's ok. but i think it needs to be in with the facilities stuff. and good point about people with poor hearing supplementing their hearing with lip reading. linda diaz at lila would be a good person to ask regarding any standards on that lighting question. - regarding the matter of different standards or questions for different things, my main concern is getting a facility checklist that can be given to anybody considering use of an outiide facility for a big all-church event. we can work other stuff into specific programs, e.g. making sure that there is space provided on the smg form for people to indicate special needs and what those are, then making sure that they are accommodated if at all possible, without having to ask everybody whose home is used for a meeting if their home meets all the criteria. we also need to work on making sure that programs we sponsor meet those program criteria. i'm thinking especially about alternate format materials for things like the nvc group, the smg groups and the green sanctuary programs run using absolutely inaccessible material from the whole earthinstitute, which was singularly unresponsive to attempts to get them to provide such materials accessibly. that may be a separate topic. and ok abthe possible lighting fixes. i doubt many facilities have that; sam goes for computers vented to the outdoors. again, maybe not a big deal if the parts of the facility we use are vented and do have decent air exchange, and we're not going where the unvented machinery is. i don't want to make this so hard that people throw up their hands in despair of ever finding an acceptable place. mary # ----- source message ----- from: David Gilmartin to: Access Issues and Discussion date: 2008/02/20 10:24:29 subject: Re: [Access] Survey (Revised) > > > Mary, > > I've interleaved my responses to your comments in the message that > follows. Hope they are helpful. Come on back with further comments if > you want. > > David G. > > > On Feb 19, 2008, at 10:14 PM, Mary Otten wrote: > > > Hi DavideaRe question 28, why is limited hearing mentioned in a > > question having to do with light. what is the connection? > > Those with low hearing rely on lip reading to supplement what they do > hear. Adequate lighting on the faces of those speaking assists in > reading the lips of others. > > > In the > > questions about wheel-chair accessibility, you have some specific > > guidelines regarding heights, position of grab bars etc. In the low > > vision ones regarding light, there is nothing indicating what > > constitutes adequate. I don't know if such standards exist, honestly. > > but if they do, I think it would be good to include those as you have > > specified things for accessibility for folks who use wheel-chairs. > > I wondered about this too. Again, the issue is accessibility for those > with low hearing. I will contact some of the organizations for people > with hearing limitations and see if any of them have developed or know > of measurable standards. If not, of course, one has to rely on the > educated eyes and experience of those with the disability. > > > I also don't understand question 25 regarding venting printers fax > > machines and computers to the outdoors> I've never heard of such a > > thing. Maybe it could be taken out? > > The issue is of importance to people with chemical sensitivities. The > outgassing from the plastics, circuit boards, and toner, in the > absence of suitable and sufficient ventilation, are significant > factors in "sick building syndrome" and many kinds of physical > reactions to being in their vicinity. People also react to the > electromagnetic fields, especially those generated by computers. > > > Also in the question that asks > > about all parts of a building being accessible to people who use > > wheel-chairs, I think that should be revised to ask about whether all > > parts of the building which will be used by the public. If this is the > > check list we want people to consider when looking at outside rental > > space, it is not relevant if certain parts that our people wouldn't > > use > > are not accessible, e.g. maybe there are offices that don't have > > accessible desks, but we won't be needing to use them. > > Good point. I will work on how that could be better worded. > > > I think we could provide this list, minus the stuff about programs, > > policies and practices, as the check list for folks looking to rent > > outside facilities for church events, The program practice and policy > > part does not seem relevant for them, since they are considering > > facilities, except the part about listening devices and amplification > > systems for the hearing impaired, so I think that should be included > > in the first part about the facility, not the part about the programs > > etc. > > I put the listening devices questions in the "program, practice, and > policy" part mainly because I think of them more like furnishings, not > part of the physical plant itself. I suspect you are right that not > all questions are of equal relevance, depending on the reason for the > survey and the type of facility being evaluated. There would be quite > different expectations regarding accessibility for a SMG meeting in > someone's home, for example, compared to a pledge campaign kick-off > dinner at Lane Community College. How important is it to design the > questionnaire for each particular kind of use? > > > What would guidance under question 48 look like? My first reaction is > > to say I don't even like that question. It feels like special > > consideration. How would it be to ask does your congregation provide > > guidance for, say people of color, or women, or glbtq people in > > services? Maybe I'm misunderstanding, but why should there be such > > guidance and what would it look like? > > "Guidance" could be a number of things. In our case, I think first of > the statement in the church bylaws that says: > > 020.2 We covenant to affirm and promote the full participation of all > persons in all our activities and endeavors-including membership, > programming, hiring practices, and the calling of religious > professionals-without stereotype based on race, color, gender, > physical or mental disability, sexual orientation, gender identity, > class, national origin, or political affiliation. > > Then there is the Board policy on accessibility that says: > > ACC.1 As far as possible, the church and its staff shall make > reasonable accommodation in its programs and facilities to make all > aspects and areas of the church accessible to members and others with > disabilities. These accommodations may include facilities > enhancements, alternate materials and publications, adaptive equipment > and/or accommodations by staff. > > Another example that I found on the UUCE website is in the mission > statement for the youth program, that includes: > > .. . . UUY-OUTH, advisors, and supporters strive to nurture one another > by: > .. . . . "x^^225 providing developmentally appropriate activities and > experiences that accommodate diverse learning styles. > > The guidance I see in these instances strikes me as "this is how we > will do things" statements, not "this is the way you will do things." > As such, I'm not riled by them. But you raise an interesting question, > and it could be helpful to get some feedback on both the wording and > the intent from some church members of color, or who are women, or > glbtq. So let's solicit some opinions. > > > I would suggest moving question 46 to the first part as it has to do > > with the facility, not a policy or program; its signage. > > Good catch, as Martha might say. > > > Regarding alternative lighting, isn't there something about > > fluorescent > > lighting, dimmer switches or some new kind of lighting or something > > that makes them ok or at least better than they use to be. We just had > > a discussion at the accessibility committee of the HRC on this topic, > > but I don't remember the technical details. A fix is nontrivial. > > My discussions with people who are sensitive to electromagnetic > radiation (EMR), plus reading on the subject, indicates that natural > daylight is best, and that incandescent lighting is much better than > either fluorescent or LED lighting. Fluorescent and LED lighting both > require ballasts, which produce EMR. Fluorescent lights flicker and > induce seizure activity in some people. When I think of a complete > fix, I see the architectural provision of three systems of lighting -- > natural, fluorescent or LED, and incandescent. Building in all three > would involve extra expense, though those costs would be offset some > by the savings in electricity usage over time. The much easier fix is > to have a number of incandescent lamps that can be moved from room to > room and used where needed, as needed. > > > Sorry I'm late commenting on this. I'd love to hear what others think. > > Stay tuned to this listserv and you will! > > > Mary > > David G. > _______________________________________________ > Access mailing list > Access at uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access From lucindap at comcast.net Wed Feb 20 14:18:00 2008 From: lucindap at comcast.net (Lucinda Pitcairn) Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2008 12:18:00 -0800 Subject: [Access] Survey (Revised) In-Reply-To: <20080220182438.maryotten@comcast.net> References: <20080220182438.maryotten@comcast.net> Message-ID: <47BC8AF8.8060809@comcast.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.uueugene.org/pipermail/access/attachments/20080220/65ce372f/attachment.html From mariah at efn.org Sat Feb 23 01:10:33 2008 From: mariah at efn.org (d. maria) Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2008 23:10:33 -0800 Subject: [Access] Survey (Revised) In-Reply-To: References: <86F0AB83-AB80-4A84-85AE-780A2A8BE7F3@comcast.net> Message-ID: <59bb9c8e554829c593d6fefae64f8e99@efn.org> In a year incandescent lighting will be history & not a choice. dm On Feb 20, 2008, at 7:24 AM, Robert Kaeser wrote: > Hi David, > You and your committee have done a remarkable job here and I would > hope our new space would incorporate all of the recommendations. In > fact that should be a priority. > > I do have one question. Items 20, 21, and k refer to incandescent > lighting vs florescent vs daylight. Of course daylight, windows, etc > are essential for ambience and mood. The older florescent lights had > quite an annoying flicker which has been remedied by using phosphors > with longer decay. Florescent lights are more energy efficient than > incandescent as are the metal vapor lights. What is the advantage of > incandescent lighting? > > Curious bob K > > At 08:49 PM 2/19/2008 -0800, you wrote: >> Here's a final or near-final version of the Accessibility Survey we've >> been working on. Questions have been reworded, reordered, added, and >> taken out. Formatting has been tinkered with. I hope you will all give >> it a green light for going up on the web site, but if you have any >> quibbles, comments, suggestions, or critiques and want them considered >> before the survey is viewed by the wider world, please let me know >> ASAP. Thanks for giving this your time and attention. >> >> David > > "Science, for its progress, its understanding and so on, depends so > much on truth and clarity. And the question is: Are we living in a > society where truth and clarity are an important element of our > culture?" --- I. I. Rabi > > _______________________________________________ > Access mailing list > Access at uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access > From Rev.D.Gilmartin at comcast.net Sat Feb 23 13:27:09 2008 From: Rev.D.Gilmartin at comcast.net (David Gilmartin) Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2008 11:27:09 -0800 Subject: [Access] Survey (Revised) In-Reply-To: <59bb9c8e554829c593d6fefae64f8e99@efn.org> References: <86F0AB83-AB80-4A84-85AE-780A2A8BE7F3@comcast.net> <59bb9c8e554829c593d6fefae64f8e99@efn.org> Message-ID: In England, which is further into the transition to fluorescents than we are, there is a strong minority insisting that, for health reasons, some availability of incandescents should be retained. Here, I think there would be the same hue and cry. I don't have the figures in front of me, but I think surveys of the incidence of electrical sensitivity show that about one-percent of the population is electrically sensitive. If the US has a population of 300 million, then that would be about 3 million folks with electrical sensitivity. That's probably enough of a market and enough of a constituency to keep at least some incandescent lightbulb production going, IMHO. For the sake of those 3 million, I hope so. David On Feb 22, 2008, at 11:10 PM, d. maria wrote: > In a year incandescent lighting will be history & not a choice. dm > > On Feb 20, 2008, at 7:24 AM, Robert Kaeser wrote: > >> Hi David, >> You and your committee have done a remarkable job here and I would >> hope our new space would incorporate all of the recommendations. In >> fact that should be a priority. >> >> I do have one question. Items 20, 21, and k refer to incandescent >> lighting vs florescent vs daylight. Of course daylight, windows, etc >> are essential for ambience and mood. The older florescent lights had >> quite an annoying flicker which has been remedied by using phosphors >> with longer decay. Florescent lights are more energy efficient than >> incandescent as are the metal vapor lights. What is the advantage of >> incandescent lighting? >> >> Curious bob K >> >> At 08:49 PM 2/19/2008 -0800, you wrote: >>> Here's a final or near-final version of the Accessibility Survey >>> we've >>> been working on. Questions have been reworded, reordered, added, and >>> taken out. Formatting has been tinkered with. I hope you will all >>> give >>> it a green light for going up on the web site, but if you have any >>> quibbles, comments, suggestions, or critiques and want them >>> considered >>> before the survey is viewed by the wider world, please let me know >>> ASAP. Thanks for giving this your time and attention. >>> >>> David >> >> "Science, for its progress, its understanding and so on, depends so >> much on truth and clarity. And the question is: Are we living in a >> society where truth and clarity are an important element of our >> culture?" --- I. I. Rabi >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Access mailing list >> Access at uueugene.org >> http://www.uueugene.org >> http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access >> > > _______________________________________________ > Access mailing list > Access at uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access From mariah at efn.org Sun Feb 24 18:29:43 2008 From: mariah at efn.org (d. maria) Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2008 16:29:43 -0800 Subject: [Access] Survey (Revised) In-Reply-To: References: <86F0AB83-AB80-4A84-85AE-780A2A8BE7F3@comcast.net> <59bb9c8e554829c593d6fefae64f8e99@efn.org> Message-ID: ...and I use incandescent bulbs to keep my plants from freezing in my yurt. Florescent can't do that. However, I have heard nothing about ANY accommodations being made for retaining incandescent bulbs, in any limited way. Does anyone out there have that info?/? dm On Feb 23, 2008, at 11:27 AM, David Gilmartin wrote: > In England, which is further into the transition to fluorescents than > we are, there is a strong minority insisting that, for health reasons, > some availability of incandescents should be retained. Here, I think > there would be the same hue and cry. I don't have the figures in front > of me, but I think surveys of the incidence of electrical sensitivity > show that about one-percent of the population is electrically > sensitive. If the US has a population of 300 million, then that would > be about 3 million folks with electrical sensitivity. That's probably > enough of a market and enough of a constituency to keep at least some > incandescent lightbulb production going, IMHO. For the sake of those 3 > million, I hope so. > > David > > On Feb 22, 2008, at 11:10 PM, d. maria wrote: > >> In a year incandescent lighting will be history & not a choice. dm >> >> On Feb 20, 2008, at 7:24 AM, Robert Kaeser wrote: >> >>> Hi David, >>> You and your committee have done a remarkable job here and I would >>> hope our new space would incorporate all of the recommendations. In >>> fact that should be a priority. >>> >>> I do have one question. Items 20, 21, and k refer to incandescent >>> lighting vs florescent vs daylight. Of course daylight, windows, etc >>> are essential for ambience and mood. The older florescent lights had >>> quite an annoying flicker which has been remedied by using phosphors >>> with longer decay. Florescent lights are more energy efficient than >>> incandescent as are the metal vapor lights. What is the advantage of >>> incandescent lighting? >>> >>> Curious bob K >>> >>> At 08:49 PM 2/19/2008 -0800, you wrote: >>>> Here's a final or near-final version of the Accessibility Survey >>>> we've >>>> been working on. Questions have been reworded, reordered, added, and >>>> taken out. Formatting has been tinkered with. I hope you will all >>>> give >>>> it a green light for going up on the web site, but if you have any >>>> quibbles, comments, suggestions, or critiques and want them >>>> considered >>>> before the survey is viewed by the wider world, please let me know >>>> ASAP. Thanks for giving this your time and attention. >>>> >>>> David >>> >>> "Science, for its progress, its understanding and so on, depends so >>> much on truth and clarity. And the question is: Are we living in a >>> society where truth and clarity are an important element of our >>> culture?" --- I. I. Rabi >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Access mailing list >>> Access at uueugene.org >>> http://www.uueugene.org >>> http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Access mailing list >> Access at uueugene.org >> http://www.uueugene.org >> http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access > > _______________________________________________ > Access mailing list > Access at uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access > From KaeserR at earthlink.net Sun Feb 24 18:50:05 2008 From: KaeserR at earthlink.net (Robert Kaeser) Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2008 16:50:05 -0800 Subject: [Access] Survey (Revised) In-Reply-To: References: <86F0AB83-AB80-4A84-85AE-780A2A8BE7F3@comcast.net> <59bb9c8e554829c593d6fefae64f8e99@efn.org> Message-ID: Incandescent bulbs don't have any toxic materials in them and nothing valuable worth recycling. Florescent bulbs have mercury in them which is hazardous waste. and should be segregated from trash. bob K At 04:29 PM 2/24/2008 -0800, you wrote: >...and I use incandescent bulbs to keep my plants from freezing in my >yurt. Florescent can't do that. However, I have heard nothing about >ANY accommodations being made for retaining incandescent bulbs, in any >limited way. Does anyone out there have that info?/? dm "Science, for its progress, its understanding and so on, depends so much on truth and clarity. And the question is: Are we living in a society where truth and clarity are an important element of our culture?" --- I. I. Rabi From mariah at efn.org Sun Feb 24 19:39:11 2008 From: mariah at efn.org (d. maria) Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2008 17:39:11 -0800 Subject: [Access] Survey (Revised) In-Reply-To: References: <86F0AB83-AB80-4A84-85AE-780A2A8BE7F3@comcast.net> <59bb9c8e554829c593d6fefae64f8e99@efn.org> Message-ID: Yes, and they are working on ways of separating the mercury from them for recycling... don't know how they're doing. makes you wonder how these decisions get made, huh? dm On Feb 24, 2008, at 4:50 PM, Robert Kaeser wrote: > Incandescent bulbs don't have any toxic materials in them and nothing > valuable worth recycling. Florescent bulbs have mercury in them > which is hazardous waste. and should be segregated from trash. > bob K > > At 04:29 PM 2/24/2008 -0800, you wrote: >> ...and I use incandescent bulbs to keep my plants from freezing in my >> yurt. Florescent can't do that. However, I have heard nothing about >> ANY accommodations being made for retaining incandescent bulbs, in any >> limited way. Does anyone out there have that info?/? dm > > "Science, for its progress, its understanding and so on, depends so > much on truth and clarity. And the question is: Are we living in a > society where truth and clarity are an important element of our > culture?" --- I. I. Rabi > > _______________________________________________ > Access mailing list > Access at uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org > http://www.uueugene.org/mailman/listinfo/access > From lucindap at comcast.net Mon Feb 25 19:28:35 2008 From: lucindap at comcast.net (Lucinda Pitcairn) Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2008 17:28:35 -0800 Subject: [Access] Tentative agenda for meeting on March 4th Message-ID: <47C36B43.7050907@comcast.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.uueugene.org/pipermail/access/attachments/20080225/4eeb9106/attachment.html From maryotten at earthlink.net Thu Feb 28 11:46:25 2008 From: maryotten at earthlink.net (Mary Otten) Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2008 09:46:25 -0800 Subject: [Access] misplaced outrage Message-ID: I got this from a UU colleague on another list. Aside from the grossness of what happened to Mr. Sterner, there is an important lesson here in how this is being framed. Its not being seen as a civil rights issue. And it should be, as this author points out. Mary The Outrage is Grossly Misplaced Wheelchair Dumping By WILLIAM J. PEACE Wheelchair dumping is a relatively new term and age-old phenomenon. Few people ever heard of wheelchair dumping until this week. Thanks to a surveillance videotape and websites such as You Tube many of us know about Brian Sterner, a quadriplegic, who was literally dumped out of his wheelchair by a Tampa Florida police officer on January 29. The videotape is damning Conversely, the lack of any action on the part of the other police officers present that witnessed what happened to Sterner was equally inexcusable. Even I, a hardened crippled man accustomed to social abuse, was shocked to see Sterner on the ground as officers casually laughed, put on plastic gloves and proceeded to frisk Sterner. The tape shows Sterner's body was moved front to back, his pants askew, as though he were a sack of potatoes. This was not a scene from Cool Hand Luke where hardened criminals are treated brutally. Sterner, a quadriplegic, represented no physical threat. What particularly fascinated me was one aspect of the press coverage. Headlines exploded across the United States and abroad. A random sampling includes: "Deputy dumped quadriplegic out of wheelchair" (MSNBC), "Deputies Suspended for Wheelchair dump" (AP), "Police dumped paralyzed man" (BBC News), "Fla. Deputy dumps quadriplegic from chair" (WFAA TX). Many news stories failed to mention an important part of the story: the actual name of the human being who was dumped out of his wheelchair. Thus the assault on Sterner did not end at the Tampa police department. The nameless Sterner was not fully human. He was merely "paralyzed", "paraplegic", "quadriplegic". This story brought two thoughts to mind: first, after my father died two years ago I needed to get my fingerprints taken. My father owned thoroughbred racehorses and most states, including New York where I reside, require all registered race horse-horse owners have their fingerprints taken and kept on file. I went to the local police station to have my prints taken only to discover there was no wheelchair access. I then went to the nearest New York State police department and there was no wheelchair access to this building either. Eventually I found a police station that was accessible -- that is unless I was arrested. All the holding cells were impossible enter. This was comforting and alarming. I asked the officer who took my prints about wheelchair access and his reply was "don't get arrested and you will not have a problem". These were not comforting words. What I did not and should have said to this officer was that buildings housing police offices were required by the ADA circa 1990 to be accessible, a law that the town has ignored for 15 years. The second thing that sprang to mind when I read and saw the raw video of a fellow crippled man being dumped out of his wheelchair was how common this has become. Here I am not referring to a horde of paralyzed people who are dumped out of their wheelchair by the police but rather the phenomenon and term "wheelchair dumping" itself. This phenomenon is not restricted to people that use wheelchairs. I consider "wheelchair dumping" to be a broader term that refers to all those who have a physical or mental deficit whose existence is no longer valued. The people that are dumped are generally poor, many elderly, often have no home to go to, lack adequate health insurance, and are estranged from family and friends. The people that are dumped are not wanted by a host of institutions such as my local police station, jails, mental institutions, rehabilitation hospitals, half way houses, homeless shelters etc. Sterner is thus far from unusual. Indeed the only surprise was that the actions of the officer that arrested him were caught on videotape. No tape no story. This is not speculation. This is a fact. "Dumping" is a convenient, cost-effective way of eliminating people who have no social standing. Such events appear in the news with alarming regularity but are quickly forgotten. They are never perceived as a violation of a person's civil rights. For example, last month Gabino Olvera, a mentally ill paraplegic man was dumped on Skid Row. Hollywood Presbyterian medical Center "discharged" Olvera in a soiled hospital gown without a wheelchair. Several witnesses reported that Olvera was clutching hospital documents between his teeth and was crawling back toward the van that dumped him on the street. Wheelchair dumping is the antithesis of inclusion. Disability rights activists coined the term inclusion over the well-known concept mainstreaming. For nearly two decades disabled people have fought to be included, their existence valued. This effort has met stiff resistance -- especially in the court and educational system. Disability rights activists have fought for inclusion because it reflects the idea that all members of society are equal and capable. In theory this idea